2Pack will call the bottom now!


#641

How long will they remain as students places? A high vacancy rate will probably lead to a media campaign followed up by pressure on government to allow a change in use?


#642

99% of Irish Students, or rather their parents, cannot afford Dublin…full stop. That is across the board and relatively little to do with the recent flurry in dual use accommodation built inside the canals. :frowning:

The young wan down the road from me was offered DCU accommodation but ONLY if she got 500 points for teaching, she wasn’t happy with her leaving cert and she did a change of mind to Limerick in July. Lo and behold…she got her 500 points and is now in Limerick and not happy to be there. :smiley:

10 years ago she would have stuck with Dublin, but not any more. Too expensive a mistake.


#643

Say if 4 students take a 3 bed semi, then there’s going to be a ton of extra supply hitting the rental market in the next 12 months or so. Students prefer to live on campus or in these new types of student-only developments.
It’s close to their friends etc.

Student builds are also hidden from the ‘new builds’ statistics.


#644

Ahhh. Allowing for some ‘feral’ behaviour by students and adjusting for the national ratio of 2.7 persons per ‘home’ we could surmise that every 4 students = 1 x 3 bed semi like you say.

“Student builds are also hidden from the ‘new builds’ statistics.”

Forgot that, thanks. Therefore every 3 student beds, plus a ferality factor, is equivalent to 1 x 3 med semi hitting the market and 3000 student beds hitting the market in a year is a good substitute for 1000 houses being built. In Galway the student beds are providing the equivalent of a good sized Galway housing estate a year since 2018 and like you say these are not in the official building stats.

IIRC these are big business in Dublin since 2016 or thereabouts and a lot of the Dublin schemes are well big, But I don’t have aggregated numbers to hand.



#645

I’m open to be corrected on this.
But can’t find them recorded on any residential ‘new build’ figures.

In other news, if they begin coming up for sale, does that signify the top of the student market ?


#646

They are all owned by funds so that would mean an entire complex coming up for sale would it not,?

In the UK there were quite a few timeshare type schemes which have recently collapsed but I am not aware of any built here with retail investors cash. It all seems to be funds or funds of funds financing them.

Depends on the investors horizons, they might flip to a pension fund after a year of operation or so or they might hold longer. I’d say that if 20-30% of the lot of them were for sale then we are at peak, yes. And the activity rate will collapse within a year to 0 if that is the case. Right now activity is still pretty febrile.


#647

As I understand it student accommodation in the likes of UCD is only available to foreign students who are paying full fees or to 1st year students on a first come first served basis. (I could be wrong about this).

Thus if more capacity is built it can potentially tap into a huge market of 2nd, 3rd and 4th years who would be happy to stay on campus, close to all the facilities and their friends. So there is probably still a way to go in the student accommodation market and I see further developments on the horizon such as the planned conversion of the Leisureplex site at Stillorgan into a big block of apartments, probably aimed at this market.


#648

That is the general plan in Galway, As foreign students pay fees of up to €40k (medical fees) on occasion the plan is to offer them guaranteed accommodation in Nuns Island when that quarter is developed starting perhaps 2021. In the interim they can be housed further upriver along the Corrib.

Offhand I think there are c.500 foreign medical students in NUIG at any given time.

NUIG and UCD and indeed DCU know that leaving them poor foreigners to the variegated mercies of The Morkesh is a bad bad business, long term. Trinners and the RCS don’t seem to care.

Limerick and Waterford don’t have large spikes of tourists in summer and there is not much supplemental business to be had there. This explains why the student accommodation concentration is in Dublin Cork and Galway only. I don’t see that dynamic changing unless someone builds a college in Kilkenny perhaps. :slight_smile:

and as for Letterkenny?? Psst anyone want a near new 2005 build Section 50 …going cheap???


#649

Absolutely.
However, increased supply will bring prices down.
Or alternatively, the farther you are from the college, the less you can charge.


#650

In a case such as this, where major money has to be invested, is there any chance of reversing the section and making them into normal apartments etc ?


#651

Student apartments can be converted to “shared living” spaces quite easily. Possibly as little effort as a lick of paint.

Normal apartments could be retrocreated if they were remodelled majorly inside. I have a notion (somewhere) that the BER ratings on student apartments are fairly shite and that could affect their disposal on the private sales market.

Your exit strategy in a city centre location would be shared living I reckon.


#652

If I was building them now, I’d make them convertible to normal apartments.


#653

As every single student block is going straight to ABP as an SHD nowadays, and as the SHD process itself is currently under review, you better get onto Murphy quick if you want to change the rules to make the buildings convertible.

I think shared living, done properly, has a future. You need a replacement for the bedsits that are no longer there and proper shared living facilities in the deep urban fabric are an ideal modern replacement for that end of the market. Dublin currently has some good and some absolutely shite shared living proposals in the pipeline with the first delivering to market next year.

Therefore we need some standards, and quick. I don’t really want to see shared living in the burbs and exurbs though.


#654

Students need ‘boutique hotel’ standards these days it appears…

Further permission has also been granted for 3,888 student bed-spaces within 1km of the site.

The promoters expect three-quarters of the accommodation to be taken up by international student, with the remaining quarter expected to consist of Irish students.


#655

Id be wary of the boutique hotel label. Murph likened shared living to a boutique hotel. Sounds as boutique as corrib village.


#656

“Dublin Cork and Galway” again, like I said. :slight_smile:

I still suspect a lot of these are destined to be converted to shared living for workers over the next 5-10 years, posh bedsits if you will.

We still need “shared living” facilities downmarket together with a cap on total numbers of shared living bedspaces, they should not account for more than around 10% of the bedrooms in the area inside the canals.


#657

I am guessing most of the colleges are now back? There seems to be still availability in some of the student units that seem to be newly built.

At these prices not that surprising…

4 bed - 1080pw - Carmans Hall, The Liberties


#658

Is there any check that you are a registered student before you can rent this accommodation? It doesn’t say so in the ad. Given that these are effectively subsidised by taxpayers I’d like to think that their use is restricted to the student population. Also if I was a parent of student I’d like to have that reassurance as well.


#659

I understand that there are more student blocks completing soon in Dublin.

One site has applied for planning permission for conversion to “shared living space” accommodation.


#660

We will see a few conversions to ‘shared living’ , some as new planning permissions pre construction and some post construction. Students (their parents I mean) cannot afford these shiny edifices in Dublin …the Galway prices are more realistic for students.

Shared Living is a posh name for bedsits but they are badly needed and as long as the shared space is a high quality I encourage more. The shared living business has a mxiture of cowbows (Bartra ) and profesionals who are in the international shared living market and who offer good co living facilities onsite.

As to whether ‘Shared Living’ is itself another bubble, like the massive WeWork driven bubble in central Dublin office space lets, I suspect we will know in a year or so. :slight_smile: