3800-homes-in-south-dublin

I’d say Country Tom is like …jayus lads will you slow down …there’s no money at these prices

independent.ie/business/pers … 44320.html

This is presumably the main dlrcoco planning page for the SDZ.

dlrcoco.ie/aboutus/councilde … ntzonesdz/

edit: or maybe this:

dlrcoco.ie/aboutus/councilde … -sept2014/

‘A flood of planning permissions’ according to the Business Reporter on Newstalk this AM. Whatever happened to the dire predictions as a result of the new CB rules!!!

This must create a massive spike in workload for planning staff and other stakeholders? How does this work from a practical point of view? External consultants?

I can’t quite work out what’s planned outside the M50.

There’s this green infrastructure document:

dlrcoco.ie/media/media,11068,en.pdf

…with a green space marked as “Ticknick Park” (“Grassed sports pitches with ancillary facilities”), but that only covers about half of the area.

It does say:

“The lands within the Planning Scheme boundary west of the motorway corridor and within the townlands of Laughanstown and Ticknick are to be used solely for the purpose of the provision of outdoor active and passive recreational uses directly related to the wider Cherrywood Planning Scheme.”

That’ll presumably placate the well-heeled residents of Ballycorus Road.

Note the warm-and-fuzzy terminology chosen for the headline: “homes”. From the rendering, they are quite clearly high-density blocks of apartments again.

The planning area is 400 acres, of which 185 acres will be residential. 4,000 units = 21 units per acre. That’s not high-density.

Semi-Ds are about 10-15 per acre without any green spaces, commercial or recreational facilities. 4,000 semi-Ds would consume the entire planning area.

I would rather live in an well-designed apartment with green spaces, shops, playgrounds and sports facilities, close to public transport links than be cooped up in a semi-D with a tiny garden and have to drive everywhere.

Dublin has enough semi-Ds, in my opinion.

Interesting objections from FG’s DL deputy Mary Mitchell O’Connor.

marymitchelloconnor.ie/tag/cherrywood/

Why can’t they design some reasonable mixture of property types.

  • A few (say 20%)detached houses.
  • Many large size 4 and 5 bedroom 3 storey dwelling houses in terraces (say 30%)
  • Many large size 3 storey duplex buildings consisting of convertible buildings where there would be potential to occupy the building all as one, or, in two parts upstairs and downstairs, with a 3 bedroom home upstairs and a 2 bedroom home downstairs (say again 30%)
  • A very small number of 2 storey row houses (say about 10%)
  • A very small number of 1 storey row houses (saw about 10%)

This is off the top of my head but an apartments mainly development surely is a mistake in the context of SCD and the desires of Irish (and most other persons) to live independently in the main.

I’d expect nothing less than that type of 5hite from her…What sort of numpties was she running againat last time out that she managed to get elected, she’s clueless to put it kindly

Cherrywood being discussed now on Pat Kenny show…the Head of Hines Developers is on

something similar was done in Tyrrelstown in Dublin 15 back in 2000 and it has been somewhat of a success.

I haven’t found any breakdown of the intended final mix of property types. I don’t think detailed plans will be available until mid-2016.

The area is already well served by large, detached houses. They’re just extremely expensive. :smiley:

the problem in more established areas is presumably “empty nest syndrome”, the younger generation have grown up, moved out (probably beyond the M50) and are sending their kids to school elsewhere in suburbs where the schools are over-subscribed. MMOC could maybe suggest some tax carrot/stick incentive for people to downsize.

I read some long-ish document on this a while back (I think it was probably linked from the Pin somewhere - someone might remember?). The impression I got was that this will be a decent mix of apartments and houses. I think there was a density map included. So they’ll have apartment blocks in the designated “town centre” part of the development, with detached, semi-detached and terraced houses making up various percentages of the rest. Seemed eminently sensible when I read it.

I don’t know what they’ll be focussing on in this first phase - could be that they build the apartments/town centre portion first, and the houses won’t follow for a few years.

EDIT: I think it’s in Eschatologist’s links above. Looks like a similar doc anyway. Had a quick flick through it now and it seems like the first phase will be a reasonable mix of densities.

They break it down as residential types 1-4, with densities (units per hectare, respectively) 35-50, 45-70, 65-100 and 85-125. The first phase is apparently “zones” 2, 4, 5 and 6a. I can’t find what part of 6 is included in 6a, but taking all of 6 then the breakdown of the first phase (as described in that doc) is:

Res 1: 3.3 hectares
Res 2: 16.3 hectares
Res 3: 5.6 hectares
Res 4: 1.5 hectares

Although working backwards and converting to units I’m more familiar with, it seems that res 1 (least dense) is still only giving about 1/16 acre per plot, on average (~250sq m). Which is still well short of “spacious detached house with nice garden”, I would think…?

(I have actual work to do, unfortunately, but I’d be interested in seeing someone else run the numbers/read to plans to see roughly what sized units are likely to end up in each category, if such a calculation is possible).

Like a properly thought out property tax but that ship has sailed now

I don’t know whether you were thinking of Australia when you wrote that, but they are currently having a discussion about just that.
smh.com.au/federal-politics/ … kp09g.html
brokernews.com.au/news/break … 08902.aspx

It requires changes to means testing for pensions in Australia too.

Because that would involve thinking and an ability to hold more than one idea in ones head simultaneously.

Personally, at this distance from the centre, and with current household sizes, you’d want more than 10% of these:

and fewer of these:

but the principle of having a much greater variety of housing types is the main thing.

Another interesting nugget from the planning - even in the highest density areas there will be a max of 20% 1-bed and 40% 2-bed units, with a min of 40% 3+ bed units. I feel like that’s an unusual focus on 3+ bed? Seems like 2-bed units make up far more than 40% normally, in my house hunts at least.

I wonder what plans there are for motorway access. The entire southern end of Dunlaoghaire-Rathdown already uses the Cherrywood junction for the M50. Will they now be crawling through a new town centre? I’m minded of parts of Rathfarnham/Firhouse/Tallaght which were developed without thought for that “first mile” getting out of new estates.