A modest suggestion - Public pay in NAMA bonds

Would it kill 2 birds with one stone, or to use a more modern analogy to bring down 2 Patriot Missiles with just 1 Scud, to suggest that:

Civil and Public Sector pay including politicians should NOT have their salaries reduced - rather they should be paid 50% in cash and 50% in NAMA Bonds?

100% of all bonuses, unvouched expenses, retainers, Directors fees, ex-gratia payments and other fiddles to be paid in NAMA Bonds too?

just a thought - db.

On a point of fact, patriot missiles shoot down scuds.

Patriot missiles self destruct, (if they miss), so we can always hope.

I would limit that to only those who could make NAMA work! unless you want blood on the streets!

Paying the army in NAMA bolds! :open_mouth:

emmmm… 'twas a joke going round at the time - first Gulf War… “How great is Our Leader Saddam Hussein? Only He can shoot down not one but TWO Patriot Missiles with just ONE Scud!”

I think some people in Israel who had Patriot missiles land on their houses during the first gulf war may disagree with you .

I think I read somewhere that because of the massive inflation in Zimbabwe and the complete lack of funds on the part of the government, that the public sector was paid in some form of government bonds. What would Zanu-FF do in such a situation?

Could they do the same in Ireland: private sector is paid in Euro as normal, but public sector paid in PS Bonds of low denomination e.g. 1 bond coin, 10 bond note, 100 bond note etc?

The bond could be set notionally at €1 each when wages are converted, but ultimately will trade for less than €1 each. Thus, the necessary devaluation in public spending could take place without leaving the euro, and since the public sector seem to think that they can survive without the priavte sector, surely the fact that they have to use government bonds rather than euros makes no difference to them.

Why not go a step further as well, and social welfare would also be paid in these bonds, but specially marked social welfare bonds which can only be spent on food, clothes etc. The slum lord landlords who make a packet out of rent allowance would be left with a load of these bonds with not much to spend them on.

But wait, here’s the best part. The banks are required to hold the NAMA bonds rather than exchange them for loans with the ECB. So instead of lending euros to joe soap to buy a house, they lend him NAMA bonds (as many as he likes). Then, he can only buy a property off a NAMA developer for whatever price he wants. The developers take these NAMA bonds and repay the banks with them. Thus, developers get off scott free, the banks lose their toxic loans, joe soaps buy houses and everyone is happy again. The NAMA bonds experience hyper inflation and so become worthless, which is also part of the plan.

Then, when the ECB cottons on to the fact that we are secretly issuing parrallel currencies, we say sorry, withdraw all these bonds and re-denominate them at current market prices. So if PS bonds are selling for 90c now that’s an effective 10% pay cut. If SW bonds are selling for 50c that’s a 50% cut in SW right there, and the NAMA bonds are worthless so that’s the whole cost of NAMA paid for for free ( :laughing: ). And just in case anyone is upset with this, the government can use the extra money gained by the devaluation by a giveaway budget with treats for all.

The annoying thing about the above is that if the Taoiseach, David McWilliams or Peter McLoone said the above it would be treated as a serious suggestion that is unfortunately unworkable at the moment so must be shelved. Maybe the solution to all these crazy ideas is to say them all on the pin first so that no self respecting FFer will dare mention them and will be forced to come up with some sensible ideas (or possibly come up with ideas so crazy that not even in our wildest dreams could we predict them e.g. LTEV).

moved to NAMA board and updated title to be more explanatory

This idea is marginally less stupid than nama itself.

I think we should pay all bankers, civil servants and judges any of their salary over say 80k in Nama bonds

What are yis talking about? Nama bonds are government bonds (/or perhaps government guaranteed - still not clear even though Nama bill has passed :frowning: ).

If you’re suggesting an alternative subordinate unguaranteed bond linked to Nama’s assets with a coupon dependent of the performance of these assets, you’ve got my attention. Though buying a lotto ticket per 100 public servants would have a higher expected value.

How would they tax the income? Would they have to take 40% of the bonds back?!

Why thank you , good Sir!

The name is Bond, Nama Bond.

I think it would be inherently unfair if it applied to people whose work could have no input on NAMA performance.

Now TD’s, senators, financial regulator, central bank and some senior civil servants pensions being defined contribution and dependent on NAMA performance would be fair enough… Let their long term welfare be dependent on the long term value of NAMA and their industry

We should be givmg them IOUs as all we get from them is YOU OWE US. :unamused:

Great to see that the pin has finally succomed to the anti-public sector “sure theyre all a shower of wasters” virus that has so long infected p.iw. Well done.

Finally?


that sure is a nice brush you are taring us all with there buddy

uh - I suggested a mechanism where a badly-strapped-for-cash employer could pay salaries IN FULL but using high-yielding, 100% secure, Government-backed bonds for part of it - this is knocking someone? :unamused:

California is paying part of salaries in IOUs. These are tradable within the Californian economy. This wouldn’t be much different from that. But they wouldn’t need to be NAMA bonds, they would be just IOUs. In essence, this was the union plan for unpaid leave (according to some of the union bods anyway), that the state would owe 12 days leave (pay) until such a time as the state’s finances were in order to pay for them.

I do think there is an overstepping the mark in suggesting this for people who have no influence or power on NAMA…

I think morale and productivity within the public sector is important; you cant treat people like shit and expect them to turn up and smile… well unless they are self employed :slight_smile: And then we only smile to get the business…

The problem is how do you cut costs without destroying morale… As pay is a huge element, it must be cut but also the reason for doing it must be made absolutely clear… It’s not punishing people, its living within out means… which is why turning around and giving the savings to scum in Anglo is soul destroying…A real problem is leadership…

I think if you read the thread a bit more thoroghly you will see that by a simple application of well established FF principles we can have a bank bailout, a solution to the fiscal crisis, provide a valuable investment to the public sector and regain international competitiveness all with the stroke of a pen. And it won’t cost the taxpayer a cent.

“Cheapest bailout/budget cuts/pork barrel/devaluation yet”

Thank God our taoiseach is a drunkard, because other countries have to use sober logic, while we can use boozehound sense. As I said above, the idea of giving NAMA bonds to the public sector is something which FF/David McWilliams/INTO might well suggest as yet another crazy 3 card trick to economic recovery.