A Post 8th Amendment world - Culture of Death


#1

Exit poll says 68% yes. Margin of error +/- 1.5%.

Wow.


#2

Landslide for the Yes side


#3

thejournal.ie/referendum-yes … 5-May2018/


#4

It’ll be interesting to see how close the exit polls are to the actual vote.

Either way, it looks like a fairly resounding YES.


#5

voted (Yes) at 7.30 this morning, 3rd time voting at that polling station at that time, never seen it so busy, a well-worn cliche but a proud day to be Irish if the exit polls hold up.


#6

Proud to be Irish today, also proud to have the hobbit as our president.

Thank you to all of the voters on both sides that contributed to this thread, it was a rare spot of debate and engagement that mostly stayed civil.


#7

RTE at 69.4%

Will be interesting to see a breakdown of the Yes vote


#8

Those are staggering numbers. I’d say both YES and NO camps are in a bit of shock.

I stand by my view that todays vote was also a vote on the proposed legislation, and with that kind of majority I think the government is entitled to enact it as published.


#9

Glad to see you are channeling your inner gombeen tribal knuckle dragging peasant who considers the vote as nothing more than a property right.

As you know I have multiple citizenships. I have a legal right to vote by law in any of the countries of which I am a citizen of under the rules that govern voting in that country. I have always done so. In the ROI I have just as much a legal right to vote today as you did. Got that. My franchise is every bit as valid as yours. The fact that you are so affronted by me exercising my legal right to vote today just proves what a totally perverse idea of democracy far too many Irish people have. And why it is still little better than a banana republic because there are far too many people with attitudes like yours. With the result that there are really only two political parties. Me fein and Sein Fein. With a few lonely conservatives, Christian Democrats, Social Democrats etc on the very lonely fringes.

In the Republic of Ireland I have been on the voting register since 1980. I have exercised my vote in the ROI to the letter of the law. Which I may add I know far far better than you seem to do. As I have alluded to in the past here in the last 35 odd years my visits to Ireland have been anywhere from 6 week to a cumulative 18 months. With interludes in several of the other countries where I have immediate family. Now after 1984 due to Irelands uniquely restrictive voting laws there have only been a very few occasions when my residency in Ireland has overlapped with a voting opportunity. In fact only 3 times in the last 30 plus years. It just happened that today was one of them. The deepest of ironies.

If it had been any of the other recent referenda I would not have bothered voting because they were either pointless or trivial. But considering just how utterly disgusted I was by what had happened in 1983 and just how important what happened back then was in convincing me at the time that the country was incorrigible and utterly unreformably then I did take an interest in the outcome but I still probably would have abstained. It was the fact that so many people here were posting such asinine opinions convinced me that if the short side trip to Germany did not happen then I would try to vote. But ultimately it was your extremely pathetic attempts at trying to be patronizing from a position of complete ignorance and knee jerk reactionary Catholic bigotry that made certain I was going to vote. If nothing else it gave me both the perfect wind up and the perfect put down.

Your postings here on this subject have been those of a petty small minded buffoon. It has become very obvious from your postings that you lived both a sheltered and an unreflective life. With little first hand experience of the really awful things that happen out in the real world. Which some of us most certainly have. You seem to lack that basic humanity and empathy that comes with these terrible experiences. No one but the completely ignorant show the utter certainty of their correctness of their opinions which you have broadcast again and again on these sort of subjects.

The difference between you and me is, that based on the evidence here, I know exactly what kind of world you grew up and have lived in as an adult but you have not the slightness fucking clue about the worlds I live in. Even in the Irish context a number of people here over the years have shown a deep first hand knowledge of the inner workings of the Irish establishment, confirmed in PM conversations, but I have seen no evidence so far in your postings here that you have any first hand knowledge of any of the the events or people involved over the years. Or any real understanding of them. Or really any more understanding than the average Joe Duffy caller. My involvement has been tangential over the years, I try to avoid this crap, but based on conversations I’ve had with journalists over that last decade or so nothing ever changes. Once you have seen how it works up close you can go away for a while and come back and immediately pick up where you left off. And that in a nutshell is the difference between you and me. Based on the evidence presented here you seem to have lived a life of well deserved obscurity knowing little outside a very small orbit of a life lived small. Me, I have had to actively avoid getting sucked into high profile situations over the decades, but saying that, I got to meet some interesting people, got to work on some great projects, you probably used some of my handwork over the years, I get to live in some really nice places and get to spend extended periods of time in a whole bunch of countries. Which includes Ireland.

And I even get to vote in a way that deeply annoys jumped up little twerps. Just one more of life’s little pleasures.

Odds and ends. I did see a lone female No canvasser today. She was closer to 70 than 60. All the rest were late middle aged men. Looking annoyed. I noticed that they had all fecked off from outside the train stations before 6pm. Having given up the fight. The Yes lot were still going strong and despite seeing lots and lots of women with Yes buttons etc I did not see a single women with a No button. Anywhere. In Central Dublin. And it was pretty busy today as it was such a nice day. At least back in 1983 you did see some women with Yes buttons. Even if they were Catholic hitlerjungen types.

One more thing. Your threat to report me. Given that I have a legal right to be on the voting register and I exercised in a completely legal fashion my right to vote today your threat to “report me” opens you up to a whole bunch of very interesting potential charges under various voting rights and human rights statutes and conventions which the ROI is a party to. Like to meet at the front door of, say, the Store St Garda Station to discuss this particular subject with the very nice desk sergeant? I’m sure he would explain to you fairly quickly why this particular approach of yours could prove very counter productive. For you. Just saying. If you want to play silly buggers I can introduce you to a whole new level of embuggeration.

Much nicer to meet over coffee and talk about some non contentious neutral subject. Like astronomy for instance. A much more productive use of your time as its a subject that you actually know something about.


#10

That’s some result if true.

I can only assume the more hardline NO campaigners turned people off with their antics.

Anyway, this threads been a learning exercise for me so thanks to all who contributed.


#11

With this clear mandate I’d expect now that all parties will seek to get the proposed legislation over the line as quickly as possible unchanged. They’ll be no appetite for dragging this one out any longer.

With the 18-34 group voting at least 5-1 against retaining the 8th, the age correlations are so strong that the No campaigners must recognise that support for their position will erode even further as the older cohort dies, and must pin their hopes on some kind of neo-conservative revolution amongst a future young generation, or simply abandon the legislative route and campaign on social media and outside abortion clinics (if such things come to pass) like their US counterparts.

I’m sure there will be a bit of jumping up and down amongst people who actually did get out there and actively campaign for Yes, but for the most part the feeling I get from within my social echo chamber is a quiet sigh of relief that this is over.

This is not like the gay marriage thing. Nobody wants abortions.


#12

I’m really curious as to what happens for Fianna Fail now, being the one party with a declared NO majority. Mehole will be safe as he backed the right horse but I can’t see much change in the party happening, especially when I think 22 of them voted against the referendum being held.


#13

Obviously the support of TDs is required to influence the legislation. It would be a very brave TD who thinks it is politically smart to try and water it down.


#14

You have to bear in mind ~30% voted NO, who represents their view in the Dáil?


#15

It is not just the size of the majority that is important here, it is the huge turnout as well. The majority opinion must be respected even if that means that 30% have no voice in Dail.

There is a possibility that every single constituency in the country will vote YES, if that is the case what TD do you think should represent the NO voters?

Even if you think that 30% of TDs should oppose the legislation, it’s not going to make any difference. The numbers just don’t add up! And I say that as someone who has some strong objections to the proposed legislation which are well aired on this thread.


#16

all that happened is that the oireachtas can now legislate for whatever abortion regime it wants. this can range from none to unlimited upto birth, that’s what ‘we’ voted for.

when I saw the proposed ammendment all I thought was that we’ll never hear the end of this.

to those nice people thinking they’re going to hear the end of it, it wasn’t designed to be that way.

Its all in the hands of your TDs now.


#17

It would be a majority if it was 50.01% too.
The query was how will TDs legislate now after we remove this amendment from the constitution - they have the power.


#18

Yes but obviously they have greater political flexibility with a 70% vote rather than a 50.01% vote.


#19

this group is ripe for the plucking to create a neocon movement in 15 years time. neocon in the true neo-conservative mold.


#20

Why wait 15 years ?