Allsop's 3rd May 2012 Auction

The catalogue for the next Alsop’s auction is now available, on the link below. You may need to subcribe for free to get access.

17 investment flats in Dublin 1, 14 of them in Castleforbes Square

Plenty of supply, I wonder how much demand there is for flats in Dublin 1?

To carry something over from the other thread, I asked why it was that Castleforbes features again and again at these auctions, and yet no other development seems to. That strikes me as very, very weird. Two posters posited theories:

Those seem like good answers, but I’m not convinced they could entirely account for the startling uniqueness of Castleforbes. I think those theories would be perfectly valid if it we’d seen Castleforbes and, say, 1 or 2 other developments. But as far as I can remember it’s Castleforbes and nowhere else. Even allowing for both a strategic sales schedule and some legal problems, it still seems most odd.

Larry, I think many developments are still for sale the normal way e.g. Elm Park.

However, since NAMA is controlling a lot of stock, until they decide to actively sell, the same ads are just going to sit there (just like the apartments).

Both NAMA and the nationalised banks have,been under explicit instructions (from the government) not to sell repossessed stock, in an effort to keep prices from falling further (perish the thought) and protect their balance sheets.
So until there’s an executive decision to change this policy, don’t expect a flood of property from this side.
Honohan hinted at a change, but it’s government, so I wouldn’t hold your breath.

On the non-NAMA side, there’s less of a uniformed approach.
Some banks decided to repossess sooner than others.
Many probably tried the ‘restructuring’ option before hitting the repossession nuke button, so this added a further delay.
Legally, repossessions takes a long time - even if uncontested.

Colm McCarthys article in yesterdays sindo very clearly sets out the massive amount of deleveraging and selling of properties NAMA and the nationalised banking sector will need to do and how it is so very unlikely to happen with current course of action being pursued by establishment here . There will be little domestic credit for buying property in this country forforeseeable future and foreign investors will be reluctant to enter here with our reputation in tatters when there are distressed assets all over world to buy in less reputationally impaired locations.

Who was the Castleforbes banker?? Danninger built it so BOSI perhaps based on that charge. ??

They are the only ones liquidating a vastly underwater development portfolio that I know of. The other underwater portfolios are merely cash cows for the gobshites who caused all this trouble, eg top 5 solicitors top 5 accountants and misc valuers and othe rproperty chancers. :frowning:

Regarding the Dublin 1 properties: there is no mention of management fees which can be substantial

Wood cabin in Cavan, reserve €95k… … 10&S=C&O=A

It follows on from this, reserve €50k, result €131k… … 10&S=L&O=A

But, you can rent one fro €550/month… … an/1766190

That makes a 5% gross yield at €131k, and probably difficult to rent. I looked at a similar cabin near Borris in Carlow, and it went for about €90k.

Fuck Me :frowning: Lough Sillan was wound up 5 years ago. And they are still dribbling out property. :frowning: … 0Issue.PDF

The scheme was launched in February 2005 with 21 properties. So after 2 years selling and 5 years in Receivership they still haven’t offloaded them :frowning: … 74707.html

They’ll still be selling Castleforbes units in **2027 **at that rate. :frowning:

Why is the Blackrock 3 bed listed as 75 sqm when a two bed apartment in the same development is listed as same? … th/1701294 … in/1848038

EDIT: Extended three bed is 111 sqm (ish)

There have been several posts on this thread expressing a mixture of surprise and disappointment at the continuing inclusion of Castleforbes Apartments in the Allsops Auctions. Some posters even went as far as describing this situation as weird.

Firstly , Castleforbes Sq is a very large develpment. In all approx 420 apartments were built there between 2005 and 2008.

310 units spread over 5 blocks were built by Danninger in 2005. The funding for these apartments was provide by Ailied Irish Banks. 303 of these were sold at or near peak prices between late 2005 and early 2007. The remaining 7 unsold units are , since the demise of Liam Carroll / Danninger now in the ownership of NAMA.

Given the very strong sales performance of the initial units Danninger proceeded with plans to construct a further 110 apartments spread over 3 blocks. This phase of the development was funded by Bank of Scotland / Ireland. Construction commenced in 2006 but by time of going to sale in late 2008 the economy was slowing down and turning towards a recession. This resulted in only 30 of the units being sold so Danninger decided to furnish the remaining 80 apartments and lease them out on rental. This proved a sensible decision and all of the units were easily rented out on good rents , taking advantage of the strong rental demand for city centre / docklands apartments. This situation continued until the demise of the Liam Carroll empire which resulted in all of the 80 or so apartments transferring into the ownership of BoSI.

As BoSI have decided to wind down their Irish business the ALLSOPS auctions have provided a perfect vehicle to dispose of these properties. To date approx 50 Castleforbes apartments have been sold at prices well in excess of their reserves ,many without parking spaces. Given the very fragile state of the Irish property market BoSI must be delighted with the sales performance achieved. It is hard to imagine in these times any other development anywhere in the country that could sell off 50 properties in a year at prices well above their reserve and not one single property withdrawn. Castleforbes has proved to achieve strong sales in the peak and strong sales in the recession, which is primarily down to its good location and rental returns.

Allsops have proved to be a very professional outfit and the inclusion of 14 Castleforbes apartments in the May auction is no accident,. They know from inquiry levels that all of these apartments will sell the only question is how much they will go for above their reserve. Selling a city centre docklands apartment at a realistic price is a piece of cake compared to selling property in provincial ireland or even on the wrong side of the M50 boundary

Given the recent sales history it is very surprising that NAMA are still holding onto there 7 units in Castleforbes Sq. Perhaps they want to hold onto there nice well paid jobs for as long as possible. If only NAMA were even half as efficient as BoSI.

Anyway as they say of the HOMESTORE plus More radio ad - when they are gone they are really gone - so relax the last of the Castleforbes Sq sales are coming to an end.

Thanks for your insights. Can you advise is an Allsop auction primarily a BoSI auction?
What has happened to the rest of the stuff that BoSI has repossessed - is it almost every other lot in the auction, or are there apartments that they are “doing a NAMA on” and holding onto in the hope of recovery.

A-HA, 2Pack was on the ball. It is BOSI who are feeding in the Castleforbes properties to Allsops.

Excellent piece of Advertorial for Allsops that Belview…nice one sunshine. :smiley:

You were only getting warmed up, I can tell. :nin

I feel like I’ve just been exposed to one of those late-night infomercials ! :open_mouth:

(Incidentally, exceeding low reserve prices doesn’t impress me at all.
Try selling for an emotive private vendor who is looking to get back what they paid for it ! )

I believe you are referring in part to my posts here, but you are misrepresenting what I was saying.

My point was simply that we have dozens or scores or hundreds of distressed developments all over the country - a very large number funded by BoSI - and yet it is only Castelforbes that is appearing at the Allsop auctions, month after month.

Nothing you have said stops that from being at very least a little bit weird. And I don’t see anyone expressing “disappointment” with the inclusion of Castleforbes properties. Merely mild bewilderment that Castleforbes appears to be unique in some unfathomable sense.

I was wondering why I haven’t seen any Elm Park apts up for sale at auction. Are most these rented in the interim or just sitting idle?

Bloody POA isn’t going to shift any that’s for sure.

Larry - its not weird , its just good business sense , they know what will sell well at the auctions. The customer is never wrong.

I have a few work colleagues renting in Elm Park.

Allsops refuse to touch Elm Park shock horror! :smiley:

I jest, much of McNamaras byzantine web of holding companies only went into liquidation in February 2012 and is not quite ready for the knackers yard yet. :slight_smile:

I suppose the real question is how an operation like Allsops with no previous in Ireland before 2010 can shift property much more efficiently than our so called experts who are evidently happier sucking on the tit of NAMA as ‘advisers’ than they are selling brick and mortar. :frowning:

You could call it A Nightmare on Elm Park