Back in the nest: an agonising tale that's completely lackin … 06279.html

‘So, is it your place or my parents’?" This is the question many penniless young men and women are being forced to ask at the end of a night as a result of having once flown the coop but now come home to roost. There are more young people than ever living under their parents’ roofs. But times are tough, and when needs must, there seems to only be one answer and that is to pack up and head back to the bedroom of your 12-year-old self.

There are many who argue that moving back home with your parents after entering the real world is somehow synonymous with failure. But these “boomerang kids” are in over their heads in financial woes and running out of money fast, despite working in well-paid jobs.

Twenty-nine-year-old Alice Dorman is a qualified dentist, earning a good salary. She bought her apartment in the exclusive Grange complex in Stillorgan in September 2006 and moved in last year.


At least the Greens will be happy.

This is a recycled bank ad that seduced a nation of singletons to buy their own pad - that was the dream, now this is the reality.

Wasn’t the “get your own place and get your leg over” line the whole premise of one stands of Bank of Ireland mortgage ads not too long ago.

Surely, the prudent approach would have been to get a hotel room for the night and save the difference. It also avoids the whole “Er, mom, dad good morning, this is … em, sorry, what was your name again?” over breakfast.


Blue Horseshoe

How awful for him! What a despicable twat!

I’m only 29, and this time of our lives is** supposed to be** relatively fun and not stressful regarding money worries. At the moment, with the mortgage fixed at 4.89 per cent, there’s no way to keep paying it

Jeebus Cristo !! What is the Independent group playing at here,can they point to the statute or EU directive compelling 29 year olds to have “fun” and not

about money?

Oh,sorry…I forgot that sort of stuff is for them grumpy ol prematurely aged Germans…they don`t know the meaning of the word FUN do they ?

How in God`s name are Brian mór,Brian béag,Mary and the Gang goin to convince our dour protestant European Union fellow members that we really do have a “Knowledge Based Economy” when our major national Sunday Title publishes direct evidence to the contrary…

Alice is a 29 year old qualified DENTIST for fupp sake !..something she would have had to accumulate a wheelbarrow full of points and a skip full of University Degrees to achieve.

Alice would be at the very pinnacle of what,we Irish would see,as achievement and now she comes on National Media and reveals…well what can a reader make of it,except a huge degree of utter feather headed frippery of the sort that might make me shut my mouth leap off her leather chair and run away as fast as my little stumpy legs would carry me.

The Grange in Stillorgan…Holy Guacamole…a big pile of steaming overpriced bland 1960s Eastern European inspired gunge. At least the old ESSO HQ was easy on the eye (before it fell into dereliction). But hey It aint all bad for Alice,cos she gets to contribute to the Swiss economy or more likely the Lausanne local one…

By her own admission Alice,as a highly educated,quailifed Professional of the type I was brought up to respect and defer to,was working TWO jobs to pay her mortgage on a one-bed apartment and she regarded this as being AFFORDABLE…Crikey I wonder what University she went to for her Dentistry degree…they must have majored on the oul Cocaine as the preferred anesthetic !!! BD

The fact is she could`nt afford the Apartment…from the outset…not ever a chance of it…and if our professional classes,the brightest and the best were unable to smell the roasting coffee-beans then what hope for the butchers,bakers and candle-stick makers who clustered around the Professionals feet ???.

God in Heaven…will the Pope consider writing an encyclical on this I wonder !!! :open_mouth: :open_mouth: :open_mouth:

I wonder has Alice told her bank that the mortgage is now on an investment property? Or her insurance company. Is there still stamp duty for investors?

Just asking, like.

Are you sure you’re not mixing it up with somewhere else Alusuisse? The article clearly says it’s “exclusive.”

At the other end of the scale, top end professionals e.g. solicitors, surgeons etc were buying up property left right and centre and are now in deep trouble.

First, her current and past salary

For current post-cut salaries in the HSE, see worksheet 10 January 2010 of … 202010.xls


Her post-cut salary will be around €70,000 assuming she has been in the HSE for 4-5 years. This means her pre-cut salary was around €75,000:

• 5% on the first €30,000 of salary
• 7.5% on the next €40,000 of salary
• 10% on the next €55,000 of salary

After tax, her salary dropped around €210 a month.

When she joined the HSE (assume 5 years ago), her salary was around €54,00 - see worksheet 01 June 2005 of … June05.xls.

(For current and historic HSE salaries, see

So in 5 years, her salary increased from €54,00 to €75,000 and then dropped back to €70,000.

Like all public servants, Alice got two annual increases: wage agreements and annual increments. Enen after cuts, Alice still gets pay increases in the form of annual increments.

For example, the post-cut salary scale of the GENERAL DENTAL SURGEON grade is:

Year 1 - 58,270
Year 2 - 61,279
Year 3 - 64,244
Year 4 - 67,316
Year 5 - 70,288
Year 6 - 73,275
Year 7 - 76,248
Year 8 - 80,717

If she bought her shiny new apartment 4 years ago, in the interim her salary has increased by significantly more than her recent salary drop.

Cost of her 1-bedroom apartment

See … y12252.asp

This weekend sees the first one-bedroom apartments go on sale at the scheme - these range in size from 50 to 59 square metres and are priced from €425,000 to €490,000.

Assume she paid €450,000. With a 30-year 100% mortgage (again a working assumption) so the net repayments after relief will be around €1,500. These repayments were more onerous when she bought her apartment than now.

Even after cuts, this would seem to be very affordable. People like Alice will never be made redundant or lose salaries if they are ill for prolonged periods.

A lot of assumptions here about how long she is in the HSE, her grade, the amount paid for the apartment and the duration and type of mortgage. But the general principles remain the same.

This whinging story does not make sense.

How about newspapers spend even 30 minutes doing some basic research and asking questions of the I-deserve-everything-and-more generation before printing this shite without asking some simple follow-up questions.

The same person is also quoted as saying the following:


Just try reading that aloud for a moment. Nobody actually speaks like this. This is make-up-a-quote journalism at it’s laziest.

And anyway, just from reading this site, I make that 4 articles just today pleading for hand-outs for those who got caught out in the downturn. While I have sympathy for what you might term “ordinary decent gobshites”, I get a real pain in the hole reading what amounts to an attempt to start a bandwagon by these arseholes.

They wouldn’t even have had to do any research, her comment about being only 29 and being supposed to have fun instead of money worries should have been shot down in flames with just the tiniest bit of thought. She’s fucking 29, not 19. What were her parents doing at 29, I’ll lay bets that they weren’t living with her grandparents whinging about how they are only babies still.

While ideally nobody would ever have money worries, 29 is quite a bit beyond the age where anybody is ‘supposed’ to be able to support themselves and be responsible for their own financial situation. It’s so bloody selfish, though more fool her parents for not telling her to grow up and look after herself.

You can expect a lot more of this pleading for handouts from the Indo in the years ahead.
It’s called taking responsibility.
It’s the editor saying to mortgage payers, well we sure carry a lot of the blame for getting you into this mess, and now we’re doing all we can to help get you out of it.

And not forgetting the €bns that have recently evaporated off their net worth from a myriad of private equity schemes.

Since gettings ones leg over (or lack thereof) appears to be a casualty of the downturn, I have a suggestion for all the tiger cubs who have to move back in with Mum and Dad.

Time share in a shag pad. With so many vacant appartments, it should be possible for some enterprising developer to do out some appartments as shag pads and lease them to people on a one - two night a month basis. It makes a dent in the housing stock, satisfies the needs of the cublets and provides employment (for housekeepers etc.).

Ingenious or what?

I must e-mail this suggestion to Irelands call or whaterver its called and claim my 100,000 euro. :laughing:

Apparently “Love Hotels” are big business in Japan. Not that we have much in common with Japan.
Wait, hang on…

This is our fuck-hotel moment…

I`ve more sympathy for the under 25s who are expected to work for free under the WPP1/2 programmes when we all know at the end of it there will be feck all jobs for them as it tackles none of the root causes of our unemployment problems.
The changes in the dole for under 25s effectively forces them to live at home with their parents. Very unhealthy and unfair on the parents. This is not the sort of society I want. When Im in my 50s/60s and hopefully I have kids and they are hitting adulthood I would like a society/economy that allows them to live their own lives.

This crap about poor so and so who has a mental mortgage but has a good job? just go bankrupt if you cant afford it. Better than living at home jeez forcing themselves on their poor parents!

In a nutshell: Dentists with secure public sector jobs cannot afford their home repayments.

The crash is only getting warmed up, because that is nothing less than absurd.

solution then for all the hotels around the country

In this case it could also be a reflection of our leaving cert system. The author gets into dentistry intially for her ability to soak up knowledge like a sponge and regurgitate it in a series of exams. Now don’t get me wrong, I’m sure she’s a fine dentist but equating high points to common sense is misplaced. I don’t want to put words in your mouth but the fact she is a dentist will not protect her from stupid decisions. Call her a statistical anomoly if you wish but dentist cannot afford mortgage does not reflect the norm; in terms of affordability. I must add, in terms of greed and stupidity the wealthier classes may have been even more suceptable to stupid decisions than poorer people.