Britain leaving the European Union.


#5763

You might look up how Hitler and Mussolini came to power.
Coup d’etat it wasn’t.
Not that I think the brexiters are fascists, but I do think they are chancers, like many in the Nazi administration.
Cummings makes a solid Goebbels, with Mogg cutting a dash as Heydrich? :slight_smile:


#5764

With the…

…would it be fair to assume that you’re not a fan of the whole Brexit thing?


#5765

Numerous commentators were suggesting that the strokes employed to try and get Brexit over the line the week before last were akin to a Coup d’Etat. The Guardian article that I was referring to previously above also implies that democracy is in the process of being eroded via Brexit. I think this is somewhat ludicrous given the establishment attitude toward the result of the referendum in the first instance and its deliberate avoidance of elections in the second ie its all just politics, dirty and stroke laden yes, but basic politics and fully legal nontheless. Granted it isnt what we are used to seeing from the Brits.

Re the reference to levels of opposition to abortion in the North, its freely available via google. Most people support a degree of liberalisation under certain circumstances but not the type of unrestricted access that exists in the rest of the UK and whicj is now being proposed by Parliament at the behest of an MP from London ie the same principle of imposing Englands will on the North as is the case in Brexit. One however is deemed anti democratic while the other is deemed a form of liberation. Eye of the beholder and all that.

See here for some detail of attitudes commissioned by the University of Ulster two years ago https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.ulster.ac.uk/amp/news/2017/june/ulster-university-research-reveals-attitudes-to-abortion-in-northern-ireland


#5766

I dont doubt that many of them may have spent their formative years dreaming of wearing uniforms. Id still expect however that the uniforms of their dreams would have been green rather than the greyish Hugo Boss variety !


#5767

Thanks for the link. It confirms my point entirely.

In relation to the erosion of democracy, politicians on all sides share the blame. I can live with their half truths but the outright liar’s currently in power are a danger to all of us. I have only a slight doubt that the UK will elect the lying oaf Johnson.


#5768

4 posts were split to a new topic: NGO Watch - Amnesty cell pushing for All Ireland Abortion


#5772

Ok, people need to calm down just a little bit.

Coup d’état, definition:

“a sudden and decisive action in politics, especially one resulting in a change of government illegally or by force.”

In absolutely no way can what happened in the UK over the last month be described as sudden or decisive; there has been no change in Government; there was no use of force. Nothing about what happened can be classified as a Coup d’état.

Okay, fair enough, the courts have ruled that some of the activity was illegal. This a Coup d’état does not make. A government bending the laws just beyond breaking point is not a Coup. It’s called normal business as usual.

Parliament may have been suspended, or Prologued, illegally. Okay. But what no one is mentioning is that Parliament could have overruled the suspension. They had the time to do so. Parliament choose not to.


#5773


This is why there’ll be no deal, and why prostituting ourselves over the border does us no good. Animosity to the backstop is an excuse. If the backstop was removed, there’d be another excuse not to have a deal.
Add together Tory, Brexit party, and UKIP and you get to 51%…


#5774

Talking about “prostituting ourselves” is nonsense and is the language of extremism.

Right now a useful analogy is that the UK government is driving a Landrover full speed ahead the wrong way down a one way street and won’t stop and the EU is coming up the street in a bus. The ROI is seated in the front of that bus. If there is an impact the UK will do a great deal of damage to itself but we are going to get a significant hit at the front of the bus.

Should we negotiate with the UK to at least slow down the Landrover to 30kmh and offer to slow to a halt ourselves so that most damage is avoided, or should we insist that any damage will be their fault and continue to play a game of chicken as you are suggesting we should do?

At least there now seems to be some talking going on behind the scenes, even if its very late in the day, initiated by sane people on the EU side who want to talk to the driver of the Landrover in a bid to get him to at least slow down. Forget the WA. If we could at least now achieve a simple written agreement that the UK would not apply import tariffs to ROI goods in return for the EU to at least partially ignore the NI trade border and agree the same for Northern Ireland exports then at least we could avoid some of the worst of the oncoming damage (thousands of job losses in both the Republic and Northern Ireland).


#5775

In support of Onion’s position:

It is sounding like an NI backstop that isn’t a called a backstop - perhaps a permanent trade deal decided for NI in advance of a permanent trade deal for the rest of the UK?


#5776

I think we all know that zero tariffs are fanciful in the event of the UK breaking its commitment made under article 50 and the GFA.

What may help is if the UK still has regulatory alignment for a few years while they figure out what they want.


#5777


O dear. Johnson is roasted in public.


#5778

So he or his security does not reserve the right to not appear in front a baying crowd shouting and honking horns like both sides do outside Westminster?

When he came to Dublin last week, Merrion square was fairly locked down anywhere within shouting distance of Govt buildings


#5779

i dont see any issue with his non appearance, it just makes him look meek and cowardly. The lack of detail on legally operable alternative is more of an issue.


#5780

Meek and cowardly … and a liar. He keeps on saying things are looking more optimistic with the EU. But the normally meek Luxembourgish PM let him have with both barrels in his absence. And the EU generally are getting tired of BoJo claiming he is making progress while not a single idea has been tabled in writing. He just keeps mouthing that they’ll have to move on the backstop in favour of “alternative arrangements”, without letting anyone in on what they might be.

Either he’s lying about having the slightest interest in cutting a deal or, more likely, he’s the victim of his own monumental arrogance in thinking he could stroll into town and set the agenda. As Xavier Bettel said, the decision to leave was unilateral, the decision about the future relationship is not.


#5781

Interesting tweet which seems to suggest that the UK could make a go of the whole thing, if permitted ie whats Singapore if not a success story?


#5782

http://eureferendum.com/blogview.aspx?blogno=87367


#5783

In the latest installment of “have your cake and eat it”:

They are just not serious about a deal.


#5784

They’re crashing out alright. If you look you can see all the infrastructure is built in the ports in Dublin/Rosslare and France/Belgium/Netherlands already. The only issue is the border with NI. Maybe a deal can be done there…then again.


#5785

Have we built any new infrastructure in Dublin and Rosslare? Rosslare is fairly tiny, with one lane of traffic in and one lane out, not sure there is room to build anything new there of any significant size. And the problem remains that a huge amount of our exports/imports to/from the EU goes through the UK.