Britain leaving the European Union.



My sister, who lives in Scotland sent me this, apparently projected onto Edinburgh Castle.



First of all lets look at this “hard border” phrase being bandied about. Given that the CTA will continue to apply this means that people will be able to move freely as at present. So we are talking about goods checks. The UK say they don’t intend to put infrastructure at the border. So “this hard border” doesn’t look all that hard does it?

Secondly I am suggesting that we do everything to avoid a no deal exit as among other things it is predicted to lead to a 50k loss in employment in the ROI, including 10k in tourism and many more in farming/food processing, plus God knows how many other known and unknown impacts. So its to avoid this shitstorm, not to “help the Brits out of a corner” as you put it.

I would love it if we were able to get the goods checks put into the Irish sea, bit we haven’t even been trying to convince the DUP that this could lead to a win/win for Northern Ireland. Why are we/EU negotiation team not meeting with the DUP to discuss? And asking the EU to allow NI become something of a free trade area, within both the EU and UK customs areas as the same time.

Its incredible that so many people want to stick forever to a rigid position - no change whatsoever allowed to the WA - when this potential shitstorm is fast approaching.


This was the EU proposal, the DUP said no, the whole of the UK had to be in the backstop.


The reason for job losses? Well that’s because these people are customers of Irish goods and services. The Irish government would do well now to remember that. Think the German car manufacturers have certainly got that message to Merkel by this stage.

Respect for the constitutional position of Northern Ireland within the United Kingdom would also not go amiss. We may disagree with Northern Irelands position, but we must be seen to respect it. The beloved Good Friday agreement that everyone loves to bring up did after all require respect for NIs position within the UK, and acceptance that the Union (and by implication the United Kingdom internal market) is secure until such time as there is a possible majority in the North to challenge that position.

Unionists are watching how Dublin behaves here, and noting it for when the time comes for a border poll, and seeing how ‘inclusive’ and ‘tolerant’ Varadkar/Coveney etc really are of people who do not share their globalist/open border stances.


Oh, uk ‘said’ they wouldnt put any infrastructure or checks. Silly me for thinking they would have to. I guess i got it completely wrong then but they said so. :roll_eyes:

Lets see how they get on
The sooner the better they figure things out the better.


Yes but did we, and have we continued to try to, sell them that idea as a win-win for NI? And to also try to win over the Unionist party in NI to that idea.

In recent days Nigel Dodds has remarked that the DUP is open to the idea of NI being part of an All-Ireland common food standards area as a partial alternative to a backstop. So they have shifted a bit in their thinking, I hope that we are going to follow up with talks exploring ideas around this, and not merely sit on our backstops at this crucial time.


The DUP are well aware of what was on offer. The NI business community aren’t impressed with them. But the DUP did get an absolutely enormous donation, from someone who wished to remain anonymous, and was able to do so under NI election donor rules, which they used to pay for a Brexit wrap around on the London Metro freesheet. The DUP may not be swayed by the best interest of Northern Ireland.


Perhaps so but I imagine they have cold feet over the impact of a no deal exit and how it would affect their vote among NI farmers going forward. And might be looking for a way to climb down from their current position. Nigel Dodd’s remarks this week were interesting.


Simplest thing might be to slip them a few million £, border down the Irish sea. We’re happy, about 70%+ of NI population are happy, English wouldn’t give a rats and we can all move on…

Johnson’s hero Churchill put a border down the Irish sea during the emergency.


Unless the tourists are dragging trailers of brown ale, the 10k figure for loss of tourism seems unlikely given the CTA will remain in place whatever happens. Unless the UK renege on that agreement too.

If the British are not going to put a border in place, then happy days for our exporters too.

However, if the loss of jobs is based on a fall in sterling and a recession in the UK, then I don’t see that any sort of border (or not) makes a damn bit of difference. A Withdrawal Agreement is in the UK’s grasp, and it will be a self-inflcited wound (yet another!) to do without one. A bit like their bowling yesterday…


Oh dear


BoJo will resign probably, to force the opposition to quisling a deal or an extension. Election likely coming soon.
A good analysis of the miscalculations of Johnson/Cummins and a likely path forward.


I don’t know. There is no certainty that the opposition will win an election or the tories. I don’t see the oaf resigning either.


The Backstop permutations make my head hurt but would there be any merit in having the backstop include ROI/NI and Scotland thereby respecting Scottish wishes to remain and allow time for Scotland to choose its way forward without being dumped out of the EU. It also means NI is not being treated differently to (all) other parts of the UK. I am suspecting its grand for ROI/NI/Scotland but maybe a can of worms for the (rump) UK. Although maybe that Can is just another artifact of the Brexit vote result.


England leaving the UK is going to be Johnson’s big reveal on the 31st October. Leaves the other 3 countries in the EU and solves multiple intractable problems including the backstop and Scottish independence from England while remaining in the EU. :grinning:



Who would have thought it, BoJo is contemplating throwing Arlene and the DUP under a bus.


He hasn’t being using his bus for a while - shure what better time to roll it out!


And if you thought Boris was bad, heres the alternative…regardless of the final outcome mainstream politics is seriously tainted in the UK


The transparent aim of Johnson is to create a chaotic situation, in which decent people become too frightened by fascists and football hooligans to protest; in which the progressive majority of voters are otherised as “luvvies, climate loons and traitors” – a darkest hour in which, though he created the darkness, he eventually gets to switch on the lights.

We need now to reach across party loyalties and demographic differences to explain face to face: what we’re living through is not normal, nor accidental. It’s a fabricated chaos. And the road back to normality lies through getting Johnson out of Downing Street.

Chaos of this sort rarely ends well.