Childrens Hospital Refused Planning


#1

Surprised there isn’t a thread here yet on this decision !

I don’t know where to even start with the roll of shame on this situation.

Bertie for putting the fucking thing in the worst possible location, or for ABP for ignoring the consequences of the rejection, or the objectors for continuing the longstanding ‘me feinism’ of Ireland…

All I know is that it’s Children that will suffer because of the utter cluster fuck that this country continues to be ! :imp: :imp: :imp: :imp:


#2

I thought the site was a disaster too; plonk it out on the M50 beside some empty apartments for the parents?

I heard that Prof John Crown on the wireless; he might know his stuff about cancer but what an difficult man/voice to listen to. Stereotypical private school southside consultant with God complex and a voice to go with it.


#3

can we pls now bring Mary Harney and Bertie out and shoot them in the back of the head ?


#4

How long would they be sitting on a trolley in A&E if they were admitted for this?


#5

Can we now after this debacle (to follow all the other debacles) create some sort of adult infrastructure planning process in this country? One that minimises the passive-aggressive lobbying, the political meddling, the capture by private interests etc. One that joins rail lines, builds within reasonable timeframes and cost, one that doesn’t build empty tunnels or motorways that require ongoing public subvention or conference centres which require, how much?, of a subsidy per delegate.


#6

I never understood the logic with locating a major specialist hospital in the city centre.


#7

is Noel Smyth still offering to build it elsewhere?

cisireland.com/NewsItem.aspx?NewsId=436

independent.ie/health/tycoon … 59528.html


#8

Oh, dear GOD!

Absofuckinglutely ridiculous :imp:

I regretfully accepted the independent report last year though that recommended the site, even though I never thought it should have been built there, with the one advantage that it might be built quicker.


#9

It’s a ‘town’ mentality: everything comes in and out of town through the main street. Dublin probably once did function like that, and it still does today despite being metropolis. It’s the same mentality that had artics going through the city centre up until recently.


#10

And also because in Ireland, the center of the city is the only place served by public transport. So for families coming up from the country on the train, would be fecked trying to get out to Lucan or where ever, if the arrived into Heuston.


#11

And only the centre is serviced because of the ‘town’ mentality… QED.


#12

Bertie’s vanity projects have cost Ireland dearly.

joe.ie/news-politics/current … -0020838-1


#13

Pretty much every consultant and specialist involved in paediatric medicine in Ireland came out against the decision to locate it on the Mater. International studies and again, the opinions of paediatricians in Ireland was that co-location with an adult teaching hospital was of little benefit to a national children’s hospital. Of far more importance was a Maternity Hospital, which the Mater lacked and was to be built alongside the the new NCH.


#14

I applaud this decision, ABP are recently showing a huge amount of sense. Far better to greenfield out by Saggart ( LUAS, M50 )


#15

This has nothing to do with medical decisions, traffic or any sort of logic, it’s to do with preserving Dublin’s “skyline”.

Dublin (or any Irish city really) does not really have a skyline to protect, there’s a reason that the traditional skyline picture of Dublin is the Poolbeg chimneys, or maybe now the National Convention Center.

In fairness the ABP were doing their job - not allowing changes to a bland skyline, but this shouldn’t have been their job to do. Those clowns out at the DAA can pretty much build any old rubbish they want without involving the ABP, why the hell should something as fundamental as a children’s hospital be held up by 3 ABP staffers on purely aesthetic, chin stroking reasons.

Also I’m slightly amused that Dublin people seem to think it’s a bigger deal to travel from the M50 to city center than it is from say Listowel up to the M50.

So yeah put the hospital in an isolated IKEA type location, rather than a vibrant city center where family and friends can meet up for lunch, take breaks from the hospital, take kids on little excursions etc… Nothing more important than being just off the M50.


#16

I worked in one of the existing children’s hospitals for 4 years and talked to hundreds of parents throughout that. I can safely say that for the mother who left Donegal at 4:30am to make an outpatient appointment in our hospital, the extra 30+minutes it would take to get to the Mater does make a huge difference. I can safely say that for my girlfriends family who recently had to bring their son up Crumlin (from beside Listowel amusingly enough) for outpatient appointments, not spending another 40+minutes each way stuck in traffic did make a huge difference.

If you believe parents of sick children care about “meeting friends for lunch, taking breaks from the hospital and taking their sick kids on little excursions” over access, facilities and quality of life at the hospital (i.e. parking, facilities for parents/families to sleep, green space etc) then you’re sadly, terribly, mistaken.


#17

That pompous hairy arse Reilly called a so-called review that did not have within its terms of reference a review of the location, just of the fitness of purpose of the proposed building. He was warned about likely An Bord Pleanala objections and yet pursued a stupid path.

It was an obvious politically motivated mindless decision: Harney’s sop to Ahern. You had he Bertie Bowl and now you have the Bertie Sick Bowl.

Among many other lessons that will not be learned from this disaster is that it is a classic example of sunk cost fallacy.


#18

Well perhaps but I’m speaking from my own experience, where pretending to have some sort of semi-normal life was very important for the patient and the heavily stressed relatives.

But yeah depends on how sick etc. and everyone is different.


#19

If you were building a fucking bungalow you would talk to planners before you lifted a finger to see what they make of your back of napkin sketches. This stinks, though I think it is the right decision.

Did nobody really bother to see what the planners thought, or did they put their hands over their ears and assume it was just too big to fail?


#20

did anyone champion this other than Bertie?
Bertie wanted something for his constituency.
nobody appears to know where to fingerpoint.
I point the finger at the autocratic fucktard.