Childrens Hospital Refused Planning


#101

James’s is the best hospital in the country, with the highest quality staff; probably followed by the Mater.
Putting the tertiary care Children’s Hospital alongside either is an absolute no-brainer if you want the best care for those children.

This is not a hospital for kids who burn their fingers playing with a Superser, it is for very sick children who need the very best care.


#102

Dr Eamonn Faller that was on Newstalk this morning coming up on TodayFM
independent.ie/opinion/comme … 93006.html


#103

Honestly, he knows nothing about running a hospital, hospital access or hospital planning.
He has some experience having been a patient and working in the hospital but that in no way makes him qualified enough to give weight to the judgement he’s making.

This actually worries me, because co-locating with an adult hospital very clearly saves lives. You get better sub-specialities and an increased ability to ask for expert advice from other doctors. In his own case, as a cancer patient of 14, he probably would have benefited from co-location simply because as a teenager he was closer in size to an adult patient, and there could well have been more suitable equipment available in a co-located hospital. A doctor should know that, and those planning the hospital aren’t in the least bit vague about it.

On the access issue:

One one level he talks about 10,000 journeys a day to the hospital, bemoans traffic delays and then he ridicules those of us talking about public transport.
What exactly does he think will happen to traffic delays at the area around a site with no public transport when X thousand extra journeys a day are suddenly added?

Yes, a sick kid needs to get there in a car and there needs to be parking for that.
If everyone is driving and looking for parking, the situation will not be any better then the restricted parking they’re proposing at James’s.

The difference between Connolly and James’s does not amount to an extra hour each way, especially travelling from Galway.
The journey time between the two hospitals at the worst time for traffic is 40mins. That’s the maximum possible difference.

From Liffey Valley (a convenient point to illustrate the journey from Galway) James’s takes about 10 minutes longer then to Connolly at peak hour.

His comments on the size of the site are equally ill informed given he’s not an architect, an engineer or any type of construction/hospital planning professional.


#104

That’s wrong and irresponsible.

He was an SHO in James and once was a patient?


#105

The whole debate grossly misunderstands the issue; transport and parking are very much secondary to having a medically brilliant facility. Connolly cannot be compared with James’ in any way; it’s suitable for patching up stabbing victims and shipping off the seriously injured to better hospitals but it’s not a top-tier hospital in any way.

This is similar to the argument about closing regional A&Es. In many cases closing them is a big step forward in saving lives. When it comes to hospitals, big generally means good and small generally means bad. We need fewer, bigger hospitals operating more departments more hours of the day.

As I’ve said before, if you need a hospital anywhere near Dublin for something urgent but non-life-threatening, go to one of the private urgent-care facilities (Switfcare; Blackrock A&E, etc). If it’s more serious, drive past all other hospitals on the way to one of Tallaght, James’s, Beaumont, the Mater or Vincent’s. Do not stop anywhere else.


#106

Well, transport is relevant for those who’ll make a big chunk of the journeys - the staff. What’s the staff/patient ratio at a large hospital? 1-1?

Right, I got that advice from more than one consultant for my condition.


#107

+1m (as a woman of child-bearing age). I would be frankly, frightened to have a difficult pregnancy at the mercy of the Sisters of ‘Charity’. Their stymieing of the new NMH is despicable and as TI said, is nothing other than a transparent (and sinister IMO) attempt at a power grab.
As regards the State, being the funding body, forcing them to allow NMH retain its own governance structure, well, you’d think that would be possible but, as has been shown by the lack of appetite to tackle the schools on discriminatory admissions policies, this would appear to be more difficult than one would think it should be. Of course it might be convenient for our government to give that impression too.
:nin


#108

I am currently in the US. Before arriving in Boston I did some research about the locations of the better maternity hospitals, since Mrs Mantissa is preggers. Guess what? There’s no such thing. OBGYN is a speciality in a lot of the good hospitals, but the idea of having it as a separate organisation seems alien in this part of the world.

Just a data point. Ireland’s Heath system is of course different in many ways, but still…

If Holles St was given a cast-iron guarantee that there would be no religious say in what procedures could be carried out or how they were done would the consultants be happy to be subsumed into the SVHG structure and lose the control they currently enjoy? I think not. Not sure I blame them but I don’t believe it’s all ideological (and I’m no fan of nuns).


#109

Do you know if the current board of Holle’s st are being offered board postitions at SVH?
I suppose they would still lose the control with their lower percentage vote on new board!


#110

What is the purpose of this raising of a dead horse? The Hospital has planning permission. It’s going to go ahead. I don’t understand this sudden raising of the Titanic. Whose playing politics with an issue that has now passed the final procedural hurdle of planning. Preliminary work as I understand it has already begun.

Politicians and media nothing better to do?


#111

What Mantissa said.

I spent a good bit of time up and down to James’s a few years back.

The place is NOT congested 22 hours a day when much of the outpatient visits and many of the staff movements will take place.

I know people who living 250km from Dublin who drive there regularly for treatment because they know it’s where they’ll get the best care. 10 minutes (on average) extra compared to an M50 location will not make a difference. It also serves those of us who live inside the M50 better.


#112

Glad to hear this week that the NMH and St Vincent’s have agreed a governance structure and the new maternity hospital is going ahead on the grounds of SVUH. As a current client of the NHM they do an amazing job with a really old building and badly deserve a new purpose-built facility.


#113

+1

Maternity services in Ireland are decrepit.

They cynic in me wonders what they would look like if astronomical sums weren’t going on payouts…


#114

Sneaked out over the weekend.

irishtimes.com/news/health/s … -1.2962801

irishtimes.com/news/health/c … -1.2964668

Why would “the source” not want to put their name to their work?

The Indo went with Alan Kelly :unamused:

independent.ie/irish-news/po … 24313.html


#115

Another over priced public piece of infrastructure. I’m not surprised.
What I will be surprised by is the project not costing at least 3 times the original €650m by the time the doors open. And not 1 person will be fired over getting the figures so wrong.
Varadakar was on SO’R this AM and blamed it all on building inflation costs!


#116

FFS

This inability to deliver is insane. It’s not actually that complicated (I mean, building a hospital like this is complicated, but the expertise exists to do it reliably and there are enough providers who can build it for you that you should be able to plan it and procure it competitively and to have a pretty good idea of the costing before you go to market… I say this not having procured a €650m project, but I have experience of multiple ~€100m projects adding up to that)


#117

HSE Chief says we cannot afford to sign off on building the hospital as it is too expensive…
irishtimes.com/news/health/h … -1.2967260


#118

They have a 13bn annual budget and their budget for capital is only 500m.
The Unions and VIs have shaped that health service in to a cashpipe to their pockets.
The snouts at the trough are saying “find yourself another trough”.


#119

The chief problem is it is a difficult site to develop plus HSE adding in bells and whistles rather than practicality


#120

The private sector is doing a 68m extension to the Frascati shopping centre in Blackrock. I am not an expert but I am sure one could argue a case for the Children’s Hospital being a x15 multiple of a suburban shopping centre extension.