Coronavirus 2020


#2441

Coverage of #shirtgate via the UK media

Who knew the HSE had advised against picnics the week before?

I was not following the Domminc Cummins story but I see the point being made that there are more articles and coverage of that story in the Irish media that there is of the Leo lark in the park.

Now the journal has been marshalled to steer any stay ire of awakening in the right way, starting to look a little contrived if not purely damage limitation.

I wonder will people begin to extrapolate backwards from this as a case in point and begin to wonder how performant the media have been on many or all issues and maybe more importantly, all the issues buried.

NPHET coming our to bat for Dr. Varadkar with the Tony’s about turn on the 2M advise might just be the nail in the coffin for this lark and reveal the level of spoofery at the top, when their asses are on the line.


#2442

#2443

I don’t think the taoiseach did anything wrong having a picnic outdoors. The HSE anti-picnic dictate AFAIK was an off the cuff at the media event and not policy.
Where the criticism is in the government listening to the NEPHT 2m guidance. It has no basis and neither has the 2km, 5km etc etc BS. Outdoor exercise and even picnics are great ideas as far as i can see. We should all be doing it as long as it isn’t overcrowded.

Cummings as I understand it travelled 250km when his wife was infected, giving a large exposure to him and his kid (which isnt exactly protecting his kid or himself).

I am starting to think as per the WSJ article, large gatherings (indoors) are the key to spreading the virus.


#2444

Listen to the PH Warning/information bulletin repeated every 5 minutes everywhere.

"You are still encouraged to Stay at Home ".

It’s the hypocrisy at play here that is the issue. If you can’t see that fine, move along.


#2445

If people feel betrayed by their leader, who has asked extraordinary things, things that no leader in the past has ever asked of the electorate, for extraordinary sacrifice beyond the beyonds, well, I wouldn’t want to be standing to close to Leo right now.

From #strawberrygate > #shirtgate - people may’ve had enough but the “Irish” media are engaged with heading off that critical mass awakening of ire right now acrosss all platforms by the looks of it.


#2446

If the people think he did something wrong, in enough numbers.

Then it is wrong and he is gone.

What you or I might think becomes irrevlant.

Thus the antics and behaviour of the media an duding a comparative helps to figure out the level of panic.

If #shirtgate is the thing that sinks Leo and all their efforts to date, it would be hilarious if it wasn’t so stupid and actually serious, but if that is what it takes for the Irish people to really see how the media-ngo-tech-gov matrix works to control their reality, then so be it, but that might not even be the base reason, sheer outrage and sense of betrayl by the man at the top is more likely.

There is never a wrong time to dismantle that construct and free yourself IMHO.

Leo should have run with the “vitamin D” defense, that woudl have been a Bertie’esque play, this Bert II model seems to be missing a few key modules. :icon_lol:


#2447

Judging by the number of people in my area that are out in parks, having picnics and beginning to return to some sort of normality, I don’t think they give a toss about Leo having a picnic with 2/3 pals in a public park.

People are eager to get on with it.


#2448

Tell me about it, plenty of people picnicing in the parks including the phoenix park for weeks, social distancing broke down weeks and weeks ago, but the media are doing a fine job of down playing or distracting, why?

Leo demonstrates a gross inability for empathy and he can’t even fake it.

Thus “Leo in Name but not in Nature”, becomes public knowledge.

The “do as we say, not as we do” is a few seconds of shaky video.

I would say there is plenty of panic now in political circles.

Knives being sharpened, the normal normal has not gone away you know. :ninja:


#2449

Actually I revise my use of the word “panic”, I am being silly, contempt is the general order of the day, you can smell it if you get close enough. It would scare some people.


#2450

This won’t sink Leo. Outside of some media people trying to generate a story, some Shinner types slinging mud and the permanently outraged twitter-verse, nobody cares.


#2452

Church attendance demographics would surely suggest it’s an act of genocide to open them early, yes they are generally big airy structures but entering and exiting as well as chewing the cud outside the door are close contact?


#2453

Our local supermarket has an arrangement where customers wait until the preceding customer has left the manned till before occupying the space where the preceding customer was standing, which means moving into that customer’s airspace, inhaling the atmosphere where they will have been present for five minutes sorting out payment with the cashier.
A diseased customer would leave plenty of coronavirus bearing exhaled droplets in that airspace, effectively making a nonsense of 2m social distancing for the next customer arriving at the till. The close contact at a funeral would be much less close than customers are experiencing daily in their local supermarket or grocery.


#2454

Have you an inkling of the age profile of those that attend church ???
Have you an inkling of the age profile of those who succumb and die with covid 19 ??


#2455

Shinner types… were would people be without the Shinner strawman, pure unadulterated establishment mud slinging… anyway the attempts to generate a story, hmm, well it is a story and here it is but one example of the story generation around #shirtgate, the reporting is more strawman spinning.

Time of posting, 20 page thread here with lots more coverage: https://www.politicalirish.com/threads/leo-in-the-park.35848/

Nothing I can see specifically on politics.ie


#2456

Ahh here, shinner types slinging mud in comments sections and message boards is no strawman.


#2457

I guess you missed the South Korea superspreader event early in the crisis and last weeks german church case which caused 40 plus cases. Between the singing shaking hands etc it is hard to see how large funerals can happen anytime soon.


#2458

Just adding to what you said. It’s happening everywhere that churches are open.

It’s impossible to get hard empirical data, but I suspect it is caused by a number of factors:

  • Churches are enclosed spaces with little to no air flow. Any contaminants in the air will hang around for some time. There is no wind to blow it away.
  • Being inside that enclosed space for a significant period of time. An hour or so. This will increase the risks. Infection risk is going to be exposure x duration of exposure.
  • Disproportionately older population.

#2459

Utilising the Chimney effect for air pressure differential in church buildings. I would imagine in many cases would be easy enough, due to the size and structure of typical churches to achieve a passive ventilation and turn over the air many more times than is usual and then apply forced means to increase it many times fold again or where the chimney effect is lacking.

Add in a ticketing system to manage attendance flow.

Reduce the service to 20-30 mins.

Wear your overcoat and long johns.

Otherwise, have the service outdoors, as much as possible. Utilise marquees for those that need, chairs and umbrellas for those that can get by if it is a hot day with beaming sun and roll out the ropey PA system that hasn’t been upgraded since the 80’s.

Simples no?


#2460

Seems to be singing that has caused a lot of these issues in churches. Choirs seem to have been badly affected in Europe (where only the choirs really sing - the rest of us just move our lips pretending to) but in the US and Asia where every body sings the infection seems wider . I would agree with the outdoor approach - perhaps family at the religious ceremony, a wider circle at the graveyard - difficult fr cremations though.


#2461

Break open the roof of the church to install some type of a Chimney effect and install some type of forced ventilation system. I for one would not describe this as simples.

Setting up a ticketing system in a 5 minute job. Getting people that have never used such technology in their lives to use it is all but impossible.

Who is going to do this? The Priest/Bishop/Imam ? Organizing them and getting them to agree on anything is like organizing stray cats.

I wouldn’t dare comment on peoples choice of underwear

This would be an ideal solution if the religious leaders and the congregation supported it. Getting them to all buy into this, put appropriate distancing in place and following the rules is all but impossible. All I can think off is trying to organizing a heard of cats.

Not really. No.