D I V O R C E and the property boom

Maybe this is where the demand for 1 bed apartments will come from.

When the Irish brought in Divorce by a few thousand votes; they also did away with any kind of permanency. Religion and morality is now well in the background. The religious influence is no longer. All the Priests etc are just a part of an old aged institution, whose doctrine and teaching is rubbished by a younger Secular “Anything goes, except smoking in pubs Brigade”. Moral or what ever you call it, is “Don’t grow old, because anything you say will be rammed right back down your throat”.

The law now is the Law of the Land. Our guardians are the political, legal and judiciary. Many of these people do not mind breaking laws of the Church, God; going off with other peoples spouses etc. The whole mantra is not to get caught.

I wrote in another thread that I thought that the Security taken by Bankers would not be up to scratch because of the mortgage mania over the past five years. I wrote that I thought that Bankers did not put much emphysis on Security because the prevailing belief was that property values always went up. Another contributor completely rejected this understanding of mine and said that the Legal Profession would see that the right security was taken. Now, I hear where a solicitor has seemingly swindled the Banks out of Millions, by getting mortgages on pre mortgaged property, and on top of that getting two and three times the value of the property.

The above Independent article is right on. It is our MESS, we created it. It is going to get worse. Don’t expect the elderly clergy to come to our rescue. We ourselves have to wait until we again see and then seek the tons of sound knowledge handed down via relgion. In the meantime, every one of us will have to pay for this breakdown in society by increased taxation, lawlessness etc.

I wonder how the Liberal Brigade will solve that one!

Catholic doctrine doesnt contain much “sound knowledge”. The church collapsed because, being a top down hierarchical orgainisation, run by 80 year olds, they couldnt keep up with the rapid social change of the 20th century. Other smaller and nimbler evengelical churches grew stronger in the 20th century because they adopted modern marketing practices from the world of business and sales. They expanded their influence to take in the white house of George Bush. Thats not decline but growth.

By the way, why are you on here posting at 11:30 am on a sunday morning instead of watching the magic show at your local church?

Come on a bit of respect for other posters and their beliefs

That personal attack is way out of line IMO.

Agreed and it has been bought to the original posters attention.
Please keep to the topic, this is a much more enjoyable experience for all contributors who wish to discuss the Irish property bubble and its effects.
If there is a subject that does not relate to the bubble that anyone wishes to discuss then you can create a thread in the Off Topic forum.

Now back to the original subject…

TruthSpeaker! I’ll quote some of your writing plus a little comment from moi

The fact that it has survived for over two thousand years gives it some credence. Do you not think?

Society abandoned the Church and its principles. Western Society is now dying as a result.

These smaller churches have abandoned practical teaching e.g. Do not Steal: which includes exorbitant billing for services; other countries oil reserves etc. Modern marketing practices are, in the absence of the restrains of practical religious doctrine, the cause of the present crisis in the Mortgage world at the moment. But you are right in some ways on the summation of the Bush presidency. However, his pro life policies, which might save the USA, have very little influence in countries that his business policies exploit.

Just like yourself, I have some free time thanks to The Catholic Church’s past influence in Irish Business Circles in ordaining Sunday as a Day of Rest.

Eh that all sounds very nice - isn’t China essentially a “top down” hierarchy? Are the Chinese doomed for failure? And as for the evangelical churches - they are akin to dogs scavenging around the table - when the great table was knocked over by the “new Ireland”, the Amero-evangelists swooped in, preyed on the weak and insecure and filled the moral vacuum.

And the Church hasn’t “collapsed”. The Church is undergoing a youthful revival (maybe not yet in Ireland), but it is definitely going in the right direction. The Latin Mass and a neo-Con backlash against the failed project that is liberalism, coupled with youthful enthusiasm, is the future of the Catholic Church!

I guess the catholic church is growing in some parts of the world, where modernity hasnt reached yet, like Africa. Why dont you go down there and join them?

Hinduism is generally accepted as the world’s oldest surviving faith, so by that logic you need to forget about christian teachings and convert to eastern philosophy. So I would like to wish you all a happy 3rd night of Navaratri, (tonight). And we can invoke the energy aspect of God in the form of the universal mother, commonly referred to as “Durga,” which literally means the remover of miseries of life.

Isn’t there a religion/atheism forum you can all go to.

The original post was on divorce and how it will affect couples now that we have a downturn in the housing market. Divorce is not going away no matter what your views. Perhaps it might be an idea to get back to the original topic.

Agreed. Plenty of other forums out there for this kind of nonsense.

Hinduism, Islam, Judaism etc. These are all focused on leading a good life, evangelisation, survival of ones beliefs and handing them down to the next generation. The modern Capitalist World just concentrates on the short term. This manifest itself in falling birth rates; which is likely to see a petering out of our society within a couple of generations. The Roman Catholic Doctrine is the religion that I was brought up with, and thankfully I am able to distinguish its qualities as separate from the weakness of some fellow mortals who attempt to administer the sacraments etc. It’s the complete lack of any focus in society other than money making apparatus that is our downfall. We as a society have given up any attempt at putting the beliefs of our forefathers out in front and lead by example. The easy thing to do is say noting, allow all thoughts to prevail; but the irony of this situation is such a society quickly turns into a society where very little innocuous meandering from the mean will be accepted e.g. smoking in pubs etc.

An extreme example of where we are headed is taking place in Japan at the moment. State handouts are denied from elderly men who obviously did not do enough to provide for themselves in their old age

Religion has thought me that judgment on how people live their lives should be left to the good man up above at the end of their days. Now some generations have abused the spreading of religion; but the baby i.e. doctrine should not be thrown out with the bathwater with our abhorrence of what some ministers or priests did.

I may have a weak point in that I would like the EU to readopt the RC religion rather than be taken over by Islam; which is very likely to happen because of our apathy. People of religious conviction would never have allowed our Irish Youth to be hijacked by a frightened old aged and anti religious EU.

What? WTTR brought religion into the debate, nobody else did. The other poster was well within his rights to debate religion if WTTR has decided that the lack of ‘faith’ is why Western society is crumbling.

And any poster who thinks religion isn’t/hasn’t been obsessed with wealth creation needs to take a trip to the Vatican.

God almighty, please spare the pin from religious “debate”… :unamused:

I know that I wander off topic. But this is because I also am very much aware that it is the irreligious mindset that society has currently adopted that leads to many of our economic problems including the current property fiasco. This property dilemma did not occur just over the past six years. The seed was sown back in the eighties when Banks etc realised that it was safe to take the second salary into account when lending mortgages.

It was pointed out then by numerous commentators and many times since, that a change of direction was needed. But the lure of property riches proved to the dominant human trait in Irish society over balance reasonable argument. Our Irish Government was warned back in 2002 of the danger of being caught in a dangerous eddy as the tidal wave of the graying of Europe caused panic. There has been c. €100Bn invested in our young people from this source. No other nation on Earth had a leadership that has allowed its citizens be so exploited. Paddy the Politician thought that he had arrived in Heaven or Nirvana or whatever you want to call a state of levitation with all this money pouring into the country; their salaries and civil servants’ went up! Half of them were literally up in the air at any point in time, with County Councilors and TDs going on all kinds of world junkets; gathering knowledge! Yea; Paddy punching again about his weight in world affairs: we must be the number one contributors to the ozone layer problems per head of population!

The situation was left go so far out of control that the whole bloody economy is threatened. You can kiss house values goodbye for at least another twenty years. Then we might ask ourselves why we made it so difficult for ourselves in raising a family of one or two kids when our fore parents could raise large families on seemingly a lot less. We have chosen a path of allowing our young men and women be ripped off by exorbitant house prices. We swallowed the line of non religious thinkers in believing that life would be better: but then as McWilliams terms it; it now turns out to be the generation game! In this scenario, the generation that grow old with a disproportionate number of children, let them beware!

Advice! Who ever heeds it? I am beginning to fully understand the evident folly that unfurled on Easter Isle! Ireland for the next fifty years will be known as the land of unfinished housing estates, half built skyscrapers. Now, €100Billion has to be paid back; the German Reparation after the First World War will be in the halfpenny place. Where are the people that used to occupy this land? Where did they go? What did politicians do in Leinster House; it’s a divine mystery that will never be revealed. And not a shot was fired! Maybe that’s our problem. We put a kind halt to Cromwell waving his muskets; but let the money men slip in right under our noses; the resulting devastation needs to be left unsaid. We just get enraged at what the German Ambassador says. Ladies and Gentlemen, we just make a balls of looking after ourselves! Sell your Euros!

WTTR, while disagreeing that the decline of religion is the fundamental cause of greed (I see plenty of evidence for it in more religious times), I think you have a fair point in that this greed (in the form of the property boom has beggared the young). Aside from anything else, this will make it extremely difficult for future governments to raise tax revenue should the country need it.

(I also like the easter island analogy!)