Fifteen-year amnesty for bust builders

Tom Parlon believes there is no market for fire sales. Bit of a change from his “There has has never been a better time to buy”

There has never been a better time to buy a fire 8)

Oh , 15 years , how did I guess ???

What pray tell does it mean then Tom? :unamused:

My arse. As has been reported, NAMA will act in the best interests of Fianna Fail and the brown envelope brigade.

Can the media please stop referring to these individuals as the ‘Top 20 Developers’ !

For the sake of accuracy they should be referred to as; “The Top 20 Deadbeats”

Who and what are they saving.

Surely these 20 big shots now deadbeats, have let go most of there staff the damage is now done to the economy since 2006 wit a bit more to come compounded by their downfall. Whats there to loose if concluded the natural course of events?

This highlights my worst fears about the entire scheme. It is simply a mechanism to allow certain “important” individuals to escape their obligations to the tax payer. We will pay for this for decades whilst our schools, hospitals and infrastructure crumble - all courtesy of Zanu FF.

The arrogance of Tom Parlon beggars belief:

Of course there’s a market. It’s just not the market he wants. He has absolutely no right to dictate the terms here.

NAMA absolutely must be stopped.

EDITED: I got a bit carried away. But I’m still raging. :imp:

This cant be allowed to happen, how the fu** does the government expect to let people like this off the hook and then go into the market and borrow more money to keep the country going? What are the markets gonna think? Another thing I dont wanna pay debt for some c*** who thinks he can walk away scot free so Id advise all of you if you get badgered at the door for your vote you need to be badgering back to get this NAMA thing sorted.

Can people calm down.
What is the point in forcing these people into bankruptcy? All that will happen is we get all their assets, we sell them off to get what we can which will be significant less than what they owe.
We (the taxpayer overseeing the banks) are out of pocket because we cover the debts through NAMA.

The alternative is we allow these people to keep going and force them over the next 15 years to pay back as much of their debts as they are able to. We will get a lot more money from them this way!

If you were one of these people, which would you prefer - get the whole affair over with asap or have it hanging over your head for 15 years and then possibly have to go bankrupt then?

There is an appearance of illegality and protectionism about the whole thing. Here in Waterford, the Government stood by and watched Waterford Crystal (a failed business, but a national institution which drew thousands of visitors each year) go under, citing that they ‘could not intervene’ and that it would be ‘anti-competitive’.

Surely there is a case to be taken, on moral grounds alone, against this form of protectionism? Are the EU going to stand idly by, while some failed navvies are protected against the billions of euro that they owe? This is farcical. I’ve said it elsewhere, but if this is the road FF are going down (and I myself am a now-alienated long-time FF voter) they should do the decent thing and stand down.

Are they really prepared to push the country over the brink for some Del Boys? :imp:

Do you HONESTLY believe that these loans (90 BILLION EURO :open_mouth: ) will EVER be repaid? Or that the Government will have the balls to push it? They are failed businesses - as are the banks - as such they MUST be liquidated, the same as all the other businesses that fail. Why must they receive preferential treatment.

Fcuk them I say - and NOW.

+1 TO THAT. Don’t these people realise the game is up? Even if, through NAMA, and their buddies in FF, they keep the prices artificially high, NO-ONE CAN AFFORD THE BLOODY THINGS!

when you say “allow these people to keep going” - what do you mean keep going? are they earning money? how? how much?

the only thing we are saving here by not liquidating is the 20 developers hides.
why not take the land off them , take any assets off them and bankrupt them?
whats the down side of doing that?
we ( the gov , ireland ) would own the assets - they dont have to sell them on straight away ( they can hold onto them for 15 years if needs be ) but at least take it off the developers.

Welcome to the forum and all that, but I completely disagree with your post.

Are you seriously suggesting that Rock-star builder is going to manage the assets for 15 years in the optimum way to allow the tax payer to recover the maximum return and then allow themselves to bankrupted after the whole process is ended?

This is about using tax payers money to attempt to control the market and stop it falling to a level from which it can recover quickly and all the time allowing certain big time developers off-the-hook.

So the small businessman, fallen on tough times because of the recession, can go fck himself but the big businessmen can go fck us

It used to be the bigger they come, the harder they fall :unamused:

Yes, exactly.

Just for the record I am willing to buy even if I have no job. There is a market. The market lies well below what is comfortable for the developers who have robbed our young people for so many years.

I will pay 100,000 for a 3/4 bed in a good area. Stick that up your arse Parlon.

That’s a very simplistic approach.
Ireland Inc is highly uncompetitive due to the stupid price of property. Property prices need to drop by 70% from peek. This WILL happen.
We have a choice.

  1. Prices drop quickly and we get back to business. Drop this stupid infatuation with property and start producing good we can sell. (McWilliams esq, Sorry)
  2. Do all we can to keep prices high and become a high unemployment society where a large portion of our populace is impoverished.

Only a builder, a short sighted landlord (the clever one’s are getting out of property) or a fool would pick 2.

I can tell we’re headed for number 2. People either can’t / won’t accept that property is fecked here for the next 20 / 30 years. They’d rather starve and/or face ruin than sell for ‘less than it’s worth’.

I admire your optimism. Are you new to Ireland? Or have you just not been paying attention?

15 years from now is at least 3 governments away.

15 years from now the hope is that the economy will be a little stronger, and the excuse then will be that to
force these guys to pay up would send the economy back to the bad old times of 2009/2010.

15 years from now the hope is that the anger that’s there today will have subsided and these guys
can be quietly rehabilitated (on their own terms).

BBC’s Watchdog recently carried a story about a developer in Bulgaria who took 10’s of thousands of £ from
purchasers and never delivered their apartments. After dodging clients and Watchdog for months he finally
approached them with an offer: If the clients were willing to stump up 10’s of thousands of £ more he’d finish
the apartments.

This is essentially what the Irish tax payer is now being offered. But we don’t even get a chance to make
that terrible choice. It’s being made for us by a government that doesn’t even have a democratic mandate.

NAMA, as we expected is now on the ropes. A bit of honesty from one civil servant and the media suddenly wakes up
to what we’ve been saying all along. Fianna Fail are making things up as they go along. Chats in the hallway are
announced as government policy.

There’s a difference between adapting to a changing situation and lurching recklessly from pillar to post.
You can create well thought out plans and adapt them as you go,
or you can shout out the first idea that comes to mind in a crisis.
FF are doing the latter.

We can’t afford Fianna Fail Whack-a-Mole any longer. GAME OVER.