Green light for ‘social dividend’ clause

[BoyRacer]

Green light for ‘social dividend’ clause → sbpost.ie/news/green-light-f … 44353.html

Party leader John Gormley and communications minister Eamon Ryan are making the case to their members for Nama as ‘‘an opportunity to bring better planning to national development’’.
The social dividend clause would give state and community projects first refusal on sites at market value and this would ‘‘lead to better and cheaper planning’’, said Ryan.
‘‘One of the developments at committee stage – and I think we’ll see it – is the offer of first refusal for public use in the development of the land. It will still be a fair price for the land but not an inflated price as has been paid in the past by the state."

there is more…

Does this muppet actually have a clue, they are going to move the loss from one row of the ledger to another. It’s still the taxpayer picking up the tab at the “long term economic value” of the site. By the way the government can buy a site under compulsory purchase order, so he got no concession.

[Mossy_Heneberry]

That land would be better off sold to an entrepreneur or somesuch.

[daltonr]

one arm of government tells us that nama has to overpay using some mythical future value, because nobody knows the market value.

Another arm of government tells us that it’ll be able to buy land from nama for the market value.

How can you buy something cheap from yourself?

I have some shares I overpaid for. Can I sell them cheaply enough to myself that I make a profit?

Are these guys seriously unaware of how out of their depth they are?

If they had any concern at all for the country they’d resign, and we would be grateful to them if they did.

-rd

[whizzbang]

Would this include private hospitals?

[roc]

@whizzbang

Would this include private hospitals?

Wouldn’t surprise me (that they’d try to spin even this issue in such a way).

This social dividend clause is just more spin and yet another sop to distract minds from the critical issues which could be framed as follows.

1. Why should the people of Ireland have to pay so much for something that in justice always belonged to them. ie. The Land of their country. (I don’t mind so much paying the building component cost). The system that allowed a select group of elites to benefit so massively from the value that is inherently contained in the land was always wrong. So why are we putting forward a ‘solution’ that only serves to keep this system going? (however many ‘clauses’ you insert)

2. It is obvious that a large proportion of the vast sums that will be borrowed in our name will be given out again to developers to market and sell their properties and to FTBers to buy said properties - since the whole NAMA concept is predicated on the idea of ‘getting the market going again’ (it is easy to read this intention between the lines of all the spin we are fed. eg. here). Is this really the best use of we can make of the vast sums of capital that will be made available to us? Or, is it just to save certain skins? (answers on a postcard)

[daltonr]

Is this really the best use of we can make of the vast sums of capital that will be made available to us?

That was the thought that rocked me to sleep last night.
Just what could you do to this country with €60billion?

And the thought that kept coming back was, please don’t let the
Party of John O’Donoghue be the ones charged with finding out.

-Rd

[johnnyskeleton]

@daltonr

How can you buy something cheap from yourself?

I have some shares I overpaid for. Can I sell them cheaply enough to myself that I make a profit?

It’s worse than that, it’s deliberately overpaying for the shares and justifying on the basis that you can sell it to yourself cheap enough to make a profit.

[johnnyskeleton]

@daltonr

Is this really the best use of we can make of the vast sums of capital that will be made available to us?

That was the thought that rocked me to sleep last night.
Just what could you do to this country with €60billion?

They could use it to buy development land at rock bottom prices and use the money to develop the land. Would cost more or less the same but would create jobs.

Seriously though, with 60bn you could set up thousands of mid sized firms which would employ tens of thousands of people directly and create wealth for hundreds of thousands.

[What_Goes_Up]

@johnnyskeleton

@daltonr

Is this really the best use of we can make of the vast sums of capital that will be made available to us?

That was the thought that rocked me to sleep last night.
Just what could you do to this country with €60billion?

They could use it to buy development land at rock bottom prices and use the money to develop the land. Would cost more or less the same but would create jobs.

Seriously though, with 60bn you could set up thousands of mid sized firms which would employ tens of thousands of people directly and create wealth for hundreds of thousands.

Building houses?

[johnnyskeleton]

@What Goes Up...

@johnnyskeleton

They could use it to buy development land at rock bottom prices and use the money to develop the land. Would cost more or less the same but would create jobs.

Seriously though, with 60bn you could set up thousands of mid sized firms which would employ tens of thousands of people directly and create wealth for hundreds of thousands.

Building houses?

Why not? It makes about as much sense and would be much more popular with the unemployed builders.

[room305]

€60 billion is enough money to launch a good sized sovereign wealth fund, on a par with Qatar or Dubai and nearly twice as large as the strategic investment funds of France or Australia.

It might also cover the golden handshakes of the FAS board with just enough left over to keep John O’Donoghue in beer and skittles for another year or two.

So yeah, it’s a lot of money.

[Alusuisse]

It is obvious that a large proportion of the vast sums that will be borrowed in our name will be given out again to developers to market and sell their properties and to FTBers to buy said properties - since the whole NAMA concept is predicated on the idea of **‘getting the market going again’ **(it is easy to read this intention between the lines of all the spin we are fed. eg. here). Is this really the best use of we can make of the vast sums of capital that will be made available to us?

Well said Roc,this entire production is flawed for this reason alone…It maintains the steely grip of “Property Ownership” as the ONLY motivating function of an Irish Government.

When,in God`s name,will some Politician speak up for a Society in which it is NOT a pre-requesite for every post-pubescent person to take out a mortgage on vastly overpriced and ill planned resedential accomodation ?

This “recovery” strategy of ours remains firmly rooted in our recent past and the need to keep “The Lads” onside…Its a busted-flush as far as Im concerned.

[leonardjos]

The ‘social dividend’ also serves to add yet another layer of market manipulation to the whole mess. And gives public servants more opportunities to make a dog’s dinner of the whole thing.

The Greens have also given Lenihan another soundbite he can use to justify NAMA to the masses. “This land isn’t worthless, it has great value to the needs of the people, and a lot of it is being earmarked for much needed schools, sports facilities and infrastructure”.

I really thought the property crash would be finished by now, and I’d be happy to buy my own place at an affordable price. But I won’t be buying anything now until NAMA winds up in 10 years from now. How could you contemplate buying property with such market manipulation going on, and the threat of ever higher taxes looming to pay for it!?

[ewd3]

@leonardjos

And gives public servants more opportunities to make a dog’s dinner of the whole thing.
How could you contemplate buying property with such market manipulation going on, and the threat of ever higher taxes looming to pay for it!?

before we go all friedmanite here

remember
it was the privatised banks that handed out all the money in the first place.
a badly run organisation is a badly run organisation.

private or public