Gombeenism or people power??
Gombeenism or people power??
Opening para of the piece:
Ireland - a poor country pretending to be a rich one, in McWilliams acid phrase.
For what it’s worth, I don’t for a moment question the altruistic motives of those involved in the protest. Just their grasp on reality and levels of delusion and denial.
Thanks Larry, you’ve soothed my rage.
in principle, i am widely supportive of evictions.
if i am to be convinced that this eviction being stopped was for good reason, can someone please provide the background on the homeowner rather than the rhetoric that is being put forward about “land leagues” and “absent landlords of yore”
ok, so I am getting more info about this, info that is being obfuscated by the biased reporting.
if we review this case irishtimes.com/newspaper/ire … 32395.html it seems that the laois sheriff is issuing his own repossession orders.
there is a high court case under way to repeal this right and so any repossions he is undertaking can be blocked.
presumably, this person could also have sent a letter and avoid the publicity, but it seems they wanted it done on camera.
am i understanding this correctly?
to answer myself, and correct myself, it seems the right has been repealed but if the property was in arrears on 1/12/09 the bank can still apply under the old legislation. there is a high court case to test this in april, after which we will know who is actually in the right
it correlates with joan collins blog post
so, presumably, the case that will come before the high courts in april will be the test to this last piece.
i support the homeowners right to due process, which is what is happening here. i wish this is how these groups would report it, instead this is played out like some great win against the “bankers”
Fascinating interpretations of the law from the man behind the wall. An interesting case of ‘if you can’t dazzle them with brilliance, baffle them with bullshit’
i was just about to post that, after doing some research i decided to watch the video. unfortunately, i had to turn it off when i heard that.
if anyone can let me know if there is anything worth skipping forward to etc, it would be appreciated
There are several references here to say there is a High Court order in place.
I’m in the Midlands, I’ve never heard of Laois Tatler. The organiser’s issue with that is that the HIgh Court is a commercial court designed to make profit. He says the sheriff is a private company? Profit making?
There’s an interview with him at around 16mins. More clarity - in the sense of less confusion/white noise, but not necessarily logical.
A few dodgy bits alright…
The jurisdictional limits of the circuit court for property (related to rateable value not the €35k limit - which applies to Dm.).
The High Court being a commercial Court…
Jaysis. Thankfully Larry itemised the reasons why this is so frustrating. Why can people not connect the dots.
Also, re. rhetoric, I see they are encouraging people to protest outside the ‘giant British Auction house’ which presumably is designed to play into all that Land League lark.
And and and…
…to tormet yourself further browse the websites of the debt forgiveness groups opposing all(?) evictions. Freedom From All Debt, for example, lists the ‘AIB bondholders’ and publishes a list with the Ango Irish Bank logo in the background
Chap in that video is a fine example of a little knowledge being a dangerous thing.
You sir, Mr Barney Gumble, are a fiction
[You have sent me down a maddening rabbit hole of Freeman YouTube videos, such as [url= - YouTube]this one
Although you might have sympathy for the sheriff doing his job, and the law espoused by the chap behind the gate might be iffy, on the other hand, it was a very powerful protest, civilised and dignified but the image of the linked groups behind the gate and the banker standing back from it all, the flag, the civilised exchanges with the Gardai, powerful images.
And what looks dangerous about all of this, is just because the bondholders have been paid off doesn’t mean the damage is done, the legacy is a feeling in Irish society that the big people have been bailed out but it’s the small people who’ll pay their debts as usual.
I have no idea about the case in Mountrath yesterday though it seems the householder tried to work with the bank, but Ulster Bank hasn’t given its side of the story. But these evictions are going to be difficult, if possible.
Powerful images down a backroad in Laois, who would have thought?!
Excellent summary Larry. It’s so simple and basic it’s amazing the amount of times these facts are misconstrued in the public debate.
There is a division of the High Court known as the Commercial Court. It bears no relation to any of the guff spouted by the Freemen. In fact, Peter Kelly (every Pinster’s favourite judge) is the presiding judge and as a result it’s one of the few parts of the Irish court system which is run efficiently.
Part of me is inclined to agree with you, nwl, but the rest of me doesn’t. I don’t think it was either dignified or civilised. There was a crowd of people there who were, clearly, along for the ride. No one told the speaker that he was wrong on countless points. And what becomes dangerous about this is that people follow someone who pursues a populist dogma which is wrong in fact in many ways. And end up being either disillusioned or demoralised or caught up - out of ignorance, in a very ugly situation down the line. On top of the concerns they already have, this is not a good place to be.
That is the nature of the social contract we have here. The higher you are on the ladder, the looser the terms, the greater your rights, the fewer your responsibilities and the more lax the enforcers. On the lower rungs you’re more tightly bound to your responsibilities and more divorced from your rights, the enforcers are more trenchant and the terms are a lot more strict. This is how it is. Unfortunately. I don’t know how protests like this one in Mountrath will solve that, but as you say they will continue to highlight the them-and-usness of the world we live in.
Indeed. I spoke to someone who was there, and who described the proceedings as bizarre.
Evictions should always be difficult. There should always be an adherence to correct procedure, and we should protect the right of people to live in their home and to pay for that privilege over a long time if necessary - especially in the current climate where homeowners were actively misled and encouraged by a variety of VIs.
But one group can’t demand that the other follow protocols and proceedings while basing their arguments on inaccuracies and untruths. Right doesn’t win that way. And God knows, there are enough ways for Right to fight without the kind of thing we saw today. The problem is, perhaps, that those who want to do things the right way, won’t be out protesting at a stranger’s gate.
I imagine the local radio station, Midlands 103 will cover this in the next day or two. I’m going off the pin for lent, but those who are interested might keep an eye on Midlands Today, 9am-12pm tomorrow and Thursday to follow up a link. They don’t podcast.
and what’d be wrong with that…?