Income Distribution & Tax Take


#21

Which indicates that the ‘lower income’ group isn’t doing all that badly - at least 2 of those are luxuries by any definition, and likely all 4.

In germany, beer is considered an essential and gets the same 7% tax as food XD


#22

Well German beer is pretty essential by all accounts.

These stats are shocking, pretty unbelievable on one level (I mean who was buying all this property and high end cars etc) and highlight that a large chunk of the country should be under continual revenue investigation based on their spending habits.

I think the troika might need to introduce a guardia di finanza based on this.


#23

Now that i think about it more, i consider this stupid and biased. If you don’t track what people eventually spend that cash on, you will always end up with ‘regressive’ consumption taxes, since it’s so directly determined by saving as an alternative to spending. And if the methodology is even more flawed, they get to consider the same kind of person twice, once as a high earning saver ‘underpaying’ VAT and once as a low earning spender ‘overpaying’ VAT. So they need to either track life-time earning/spending or directly correct for saving.

The current VAT system is clearly less ‘regressive’ than flat proportional taxes, and with an unbiased methodology, a flat proportional tax will be seen as neutral (since it is so by definition), ergo the current system is progressive.


#24

A little too ‘essential’ :smiley:

It’s not clear from the article if they even consider expenditure on “durable” goods - another nice way to rig the outcome.


#25

The latest available Income Distribution Statistics report is for 2011 and can be found on Revenue’s site here

revenue.ie/en/about/publicat … index.html

The Chairman of Revenue was before the PAC two weeks ago and stated some 2013 figures (see pg 20)

oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/ … endocument


#26

How would that compare to other countries?


#27

130 top Irish earners each net €4m pay packet

irishexaminer.com/ireland/13 … 66107.html


#28

“Fewer than one in 20 workers earned more than €100,000”


#29

Less than 5% of the population earns >€100k? I find that very hard to believe…

This can’t be right either surely or just misleading. People in the €40k-€60k area are definitely getting scalped for over 40% of their pay, this ‘average’ might be completely skewed by the <€20k people though.


#30

Those Income Distribution Statistics are actually from 2010, even though they’re in a report titled “Statistical Report 2011”.

Which means they’re the best part of 4 years out of date in terms of people’s incomes for current mortgage/rent servicing purposes.

A suspicious person might wonder whether there is some sort of organised foot dragging going on.

edit: one might also wonder how 2010 statistics are in any way considered “news”.


#31

Not so. Gross salary of €60k results in net pay of just under 40K, (€39,669 to be precise - see taxcalc.eu )
which is pretty much 33%
You start hitting 40% once you go over €85K a year.
(Interestingly, you need to earn €520K a year before your overall tax rate hits 50%! )

The real pain though is that you are hitting 52% overall for every penny you earn over 32,800 gross.
So if you get a €1000 pay rise in a year, you’ll only see €480 in your hand.

(All this is based on single income PAYE person)

Play around with the numbers in the calculator. It is astonishing how much money you need to earn before you actually pay any “real” money in tax…


#32

Based on a childless person? A person failing in his duty to Ireland’s patriot dead?
A traitor in other words.


#33

When you earn (singleton) €43978 you pay €1000 a month in Tax, PRSI and USC, when you earn €67057 you pay €2000 per month

€32195 you pay €500 per month


#34

Er, you mean the tax breaks for children? Oh wait, the tax free allowance? Ah, the reducing child benefit?


#35

As referenced in another thread today, the 2012 Income Distribution Statistics report is out
revenue.ie/en/about/publicat … index.html

Note: While it is called the 2012 report, the figures are for 2011!


#36

So 62% of the populace earns €35,000 or less.

A grotty 2 bed flat in Dublin costs at least €1150 a month to rent. I estimate that as €276 or much less a week after taxes and rent to live on for the vast majority.

So the gross, pre-tax earnings of the overwhelming majority in the sub-35k gang comes to a mere €44bn. Nearly. What’s that in terms of Irish GDP?

Then consider that most of that is eaten by the state and the parasite landlord caste.


#37

9.74% of workers earned 75K or more but paid 58.12% of all Income Tax

The average wage for 2011 per CSO was €40,775
irishexaminer.com/ireland/av … 13305.html

68.28% of workers earned 40K or less but paid 6.96% of all Income Tax


#38

Whether in the Roman, Chinese, Mayan or Mogul empires, it has always been the historical norm for the wealthy aristocracy to pay the bulk of all taxes to the Crown, as a very modest price for the fabulous privilege their status brings them.

For these aristocrats to whinge like brats that their mild tax burden makes them put-upon victims? That’s new.

I don’t recall reading that Dukes used to cry about having to pay larger sums in King’s tribute than the peasants whose life expectancy was 35.


#39

They tended to get a better return on their investment.


#40

How do you arrive at that conclusion? I’d assume that the aristocracy of today are better off than their ancient counterparts. A member of the modern aristocracy can openly disagree with the government without getting beheaded, for example. Plus there’s the private jets, exclusive resorts all over the world, access to the best medicine not available to the public etc.