Indo: Minister Michael Noonan wants house prices to rise


From The Irish Independent, 9th April 2014



Personally, the most polite way I can express my feelings on that one are to quote a former US President

Blue Horseshoe


It is not just the views Baldy & Co. hold, it is the way that they dismiss the holders of contrarian views like they are cranks or conspiracy theorists. Arrogant and disrespectful.


Disgusting, but not a surprise

I await a press release today that he was misquoted



Going to print that and carry it around with me from now until the local elections are over. Any FG’er out canvassing, I shall attack like a rabid dog!


Was having dinner at my mother’s house yesterday.
I answered a knock on the door.
It was a FF canvasser.

I told him to fuck off and gave him a stare that showed I meant it.

When I closed the door my mum - who has never used a bad word in her life - approached me a little concerned as to why I said such foul language.
I simply said ‘FF canvasser’, she just went ‘ahh ok’.


Noonan’s quote is just a reflection the state has a vested interest in high property prices that conflicts with the interest in having low property prices to maintain competitive as a country.

I’m not a FG supporter but your angst should be focused as much on FF’ers. They made the state the owner of all this property.


they are all the same

FG FF and labour are just three cheeks of the same arse

nothing has changed, we should have kept bertie or biffo in the top job, and not wasted our time and money on the last election


Quite correct.

From The Irish Times, 1st April



Rising property prices erode Ireland’s competitiveness. Commercial rents increasing make the country look less attractive for native start-ups and foreign investors. Secondly, higher residential costs either deter new talent entering the country (which is an important factor for multinationals) or cause the indigenous population to look for higher wages. All of which are known to reduce the attractiveness of the State to investors (FWIW, Ronan Lyons was involved in an interesting report a few years back with The Economist Intelligence Unit on factors influencing FDI into Ireland).

Pumping/pimping the property market in order to increase profits for the developers and make the banks balance sheets look more attractive is, IMHO incredibly naive and taking a very, very short term and non-strategic view of the economy.

Based on current build costs from Society of Chartered Surveyors Ireland and looking at current sale prices there’s plenty of profit to be made building the right type of property in the right area. Once can only assume a key reason it’s not currently happening is in an attempt to ‘protect’ the price of the existing unsold stock.

Blue Horseshoe


I think you guys are missing the point.

The shit-storm of the last years hasn’t gone away

This is the government’s solution …

I don’t agree with it, but I can’t propose a better one…


Irish Times today

Price rises and the property tax

Sir, Your recent report on property tax by Fiach Kelly (April 5th) and the views of commentators that the economy and the housing market are now picking up are a timely warning to all homeowners that the property tax time-bomb is already ticking.

Last year almost 97 per cent of homes were returned to the Revenue Commissioners at values under EUR500,000. However, the new property boom is on its way and houses valued in May/ June 2013 at, for example, EUR375,000, have now jumped to EUR500,000 and beyond. Homeowners who have 'been paying EUR14 a week will easily qualify to pay more than EUR20 a week, or EUR1,000 ayear, when the next review comes around. And it will not stop there. There is something patently unfair about a tax on a home that rises dramatically at the whim of the markets.

May I appeal to your homeowning readers to raise this issue with candidates in the local elections? I hope that they will ask candidates what their attitude is to runaway house prices that automatically raise the taxes of homeowners, and ask what their parties propose to do about it. Any solutions offered should be noted, and voters should seek the application of necessary measures soon rather than having to wait for a review some years away. Additionally, homeowners should remember party responses now with an eye to the next general election. Yours, etc,

Dublin 5


It does, don’t worry. they’ll get at least as much of an earfull as any FG’er who dares darken my door


Labour as well will get a broadside from me, just for being Labour!. Normally, I’m polite to all…take their leaflet and let it pass me by.
But this time it’s different :smiling_imp:

At the last general election, FF came to my door. I was shocked initially. And then I told the lady that not in a million years would I vote for them ever again. Her response was ‘sure, are the other parties any better’ !!! I was taken aback that she would use such a glib response rather than fight her corner and go through policies etc. But she was right in fairness…though it does say a lot about whats out there to vote for


I think the vast majority of homeowners would be quite happy to pay an increase in property tax resulting from an increase in their house valuation.


Actually, I would have more irritation for FG. It’s one thing, for example, to create a property bubble. It takes another level of idiocy to create a second one, pretend it’s not existing, and suggest it’s good for the country less than 10 years later.

In any case, I seem to recall that FG had all sorts of schemes in the 2007 election manifesto which included giving free money to FTBs which supports my view that they are no better than FF in this respect, and under the circumstances of Noonan’s recent comments and some discussions I had with Terence O’Flanagan before he found a conscience and stopped being a local FG TD, they are probably worse.

The state does not have a vested interest in high property prices. There may be a perception that it does but in the grand scheme of things if it wants ongoing economic growth and increased tax revenues between commercial profits and PAYE, it has an interest in lower accommodation costs, either via rent or sales. The government parties, on the other hand, have a vested interest in higher property prices because that appeals to the cohort they expect to get to vote for them


Fuppin’ 2008 all over again but with a new added 2014 flavour and some 2006 sprinkles of hundreds & thousands to top it all off! :sick:


I’m much more hostile to FF after years of their rule, but on reflection I’d say +1 to your comment.

…for me it comes down to following through on your selling proposition. Fianna Fail has never really pitched itself as a party of ethics or responsibility (personal/corporate), so the property bubble was very much a follow-through on their standard modus operandi, and it was a reasonably clear repetition of the economic destruction (and populism) they have previously wreaked on the Irish nation.

Fine Gael would market itself much more as a party with principles, and a sense of duty/responsibility. Some reputation-for/track-record-of taking tough decisions in the past (e.g. Tallaght strategy) and helping clean up messes. But, as you say, they came in after FF’s dirty protest all over the walls of the Irish economy, and essentially started daubing more shite on the walls to fill in any gaps where it had started to flake off. Not really much worse, but a greater divergence from what they would pitch themselves as (however, probably a true reflection what the party actually is)

Don’t focus too narrowly: it’s maybe not only about winning votes. Rising property prices are also something the politicians, party officials, and those in their families/social-circles could personally benefit from. (declaration of interests?)


Agree, they are no different to FF, perhaps less shifty but ultimately they lack any vision and are clueless in terms of dealing with Ireland’s dysfunctional internal economy.


Can I jump right in and say FF & FG are the same in that they both promote nepotism - 2’nd and 3’rd generation politicians.
Kenny inherited his seat from his dead father, as did such last dail FF luminaries as Cowen, Coughlan, Lenihan, together with other more diluted bad blood such as O’Cuiv, Hanafin, Andrews and many more.

Nepotism - the single greatest scourge of Irish Politics…and Public Service. At least we get a choice with out politcians but rarely use it - so "don’t vote for anybody related to anybody"


What is the alternative to FF \ FG \ Labour?

The civil service run the country anyway with a little bit of input from the government of the day.

Would SF be any different? I doubt it.

What about the anti-everything parties? What the hell could they achieve?