MCW - €4.5k per pupil, per year subsidy to private schools


#401

I hate to say this, but that film makes me feel as though Belvedere is simply boosting its intake by 10% with the scholarship kids. I found it really hard to watch.

I remember as a child just wanting to be like everyone else, in primary, going into secondry. These kids are being used to promote the image if the school as benevolent - it is self serving of the school and potentially detrimental to the candidates. If this were about inclusion, the scholarship children would be integrated without ceremony. Kids can be really cruel to eachother and their parents’ financial situation is no-ones business, no-one at the school gates anyway.

When I think of that dreadful Katie Hopkins woman talking on TV here about now allowing her little darlings to associate with kids who she feels have “common” names. It makes me cringe.

No one decides to run a scheme like this because they want to do harm I am sure, but the management at Belvedere College should do some soul searching about what they are actually trying to achieve here. Where is the equality and respect for privacy?


#402

A friend has his kids in BC. It’s not an exercise in boosting numbers - the school is oversubscribed already. I think the scholarship scheme has been running for 10 years or so, and the charity that funds the scholarships is largely supported by parents and alumni. What I would like to see, but it’s probably not a runner, is a real mix of kids at the school - say 20% intake from the inner city, 20% from SCD, 20% from NCD, 10% from Tallaght, 10% from Meath, and so on. Get parents to pay what they can afford but make the mix so extensive that no one group of kids is in a majority situation over another group.


#403

Belvedere campaign under way.


#404

Indeed, and before the current scholarship system, there were part bursaries (means tested) based on entrance exams.


#405

that reminds me, when I was entering secondary school we did an entrance exam - in my school that was only for streaming but other schools turned away pupils based on results (private ones generally) shortly afterwards the exam component was banned as a selection method but to this day parental ties are still allowed as a selection criterion.

Says it all about Ruairi Quinn and the rest of the hypocrites


#406

Very poor performance in this OECD basic education study. Education in Ireland is down there with the USA.

theguardian.com/education/20 … ague-table


#407

Glad I’m not Welsh or Scottish!
Remarkable poor show; and sandwiched between all those clever English and 2 part Irish and all!


#408

From the article

:smiley:


#409

Some schools must be very poor to do so badly on very basic stuff like reading and basic arithmetic. Anyone know what percentage of secondary school students attain their leaving cert?


#410

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leaving_Ce … e_(Ireland

It’s up to you!

napd.ie/cmsv1/phocadownload/ … 202013.pdf


#411

Yeah, terrible. Right down there with Norway…


#412

Good thing our kids spend all that compulsory time learning Irish and religion from the age of 4! Surely that’ll stand to them in the job market!


#413

view from the US now is that an Arts and rounded education is better than trying to make people learn useful stuff as useful stuff goes out of date.

Learning something in primary school with an eye on a jobs market seems mad to me. A lot of jobs people want today didn’t exist five years ago

“not a vessel to be filled but a mind to be kindled” etc


#414

Ya you are right about cyclical skills. Engineering is needed sometimes, then science, computers and foreign languages etc.

Irish and religion are not needed and never ever will be needed.

Teaching irish and religion is absolute and total waste of time. At least 5 hours a week out of children’s education.
We might as well be teaching Swahili and Greek mythology.


#415

Whatever about Irish, and if it were well taught it seems there is little harm in having an extra language, but religion is a fundamental human force as important to understanding the world as geography or any of the sciences. In Ireland perhaps it is simply the outsourcing of Catholic indoctrination, and that is unfortunate and of very little use to anyone. But teaching children about religion and how it manifests in human history and society is really important.


#416

I think the report might be a reflection of how our schools work - the gifted excel, average joes get by, special attention (language/intellectual difficulties) get extra resources but the less than average get left behind

Also, the literacy didn’t just reflect the ‘3 R’s’, there were failures with respect to comprehension, I think this is reason enough to try and move away from rote learning and encourage independent critical thinking


#417

I was taught “religious studies” at school (not in Ireland). It was brilliant. Our teacher was quite devoutly Jewish but wouldn’t discuss his personal beliefs. We learned loads of wonderful stuff about ancient and modern religions, from Stonehenge to Islam (and probably more that I’ve since forgotten). It fostered in me a deep fascination for all sorts of imaginary-friend-ery that persisted through my adult life until I moved to Ireland and found myself frustrated and appalled by the reality of non-secular State institutions.


#418

In fairness, religion is practiced. But Irish Gaelic is hardly spoken anywhere, anymore - apart from in a tokenistic way (“I’m off to me leaba,” etc) And it’s not our “native” language, or our “first” language or any of the other meaningless terms that are bandied about when it comes to Irish Gaelic. Making it compulsory is a hugely wasteful use of school time…

humanrights.ie/constitution-of-i … and-north/
Irish was not even among the top ten most used languages in the courts last year. The cost of providing interpretation services for Irish was less than €2,000 in total during 2006 and fell further to €1,012 in 2007, according to official figures provided by the Courts Service. By contrast, over 10,000 requests were made to the Courts Service last year for interpreters for 71 different languages. Polish topped the list. The other main languages were Romanian, Lithuanian, Russian, Mandarin Chinese, Latvian, Portuguese, French, Czech and Arabic.


#419

Find me an Irish person who is not fluent in English and I will show you someone who had 2k spent on translating court proceedings last year. And as you wont find anyone suitable there is a crank out there who insisted on Irish being used.


#420

Indeed. But what about Irish and religion?

Also, maths doesn’t really go out of date.