Operation Phase I - DIY (No Money Up Front)


#81

Best reply I’ve got so far! :smiley:

From a FG TD


#82

tweeting on twiter @nomoneyupfront


#83

#84

A positive reply from a Green Party member. This is a facebook reply to my ‘No to NAMA’ group message to publicise our Phase I campaign.

Can anyone compile a list of the email addresses of key FF backbenchers and Independents? :bulb:


#85

This is a response I received from a FF’er after I queried him further on his yes answer


#86

I think the explanation is a pure fantasy.

The TD is admitting that the Banks are holding the country to ransom and the TD’s are complicit in letting them do so the Dail has the power to nationalise anything if it needs to our constitution is very strong simply read article 43 it there in black and white.

We have a corrupt utterly supine government.

Why the hell should we give the banks our money and then have them lend it back to us at interest.

Theft followed by extortion some thanks! :imp:

I would also recommend many users not involved directly if you don’t feel confident as this is a volume campaign. You may get very frustrated and these guys have made a career of “managing” people and their complaints.

Its not easy they are good at what they do but doesn’t qualify them to run a country or economy.
Which is obvious form their post. Believe me I’ve challenged a few in my time its not easy they know all the tricks.

That lending excuse has been trotted out ad nauseum for over a year now. Total rubbish.

The Banks have been and continue to be reckless operators and deserve not a cent of our aid to then charge us for the privileged? Insult to injury, gunshot wound to cut.


#87

Sent my first email to Trevor Sargent, will do more…


#88

No matter how well intentioned the Green party member was who said the above , we (the Irish people) should not rely simply on internal Green party discussion to resolve this. It’s much too serious now.

The emailing and contacting of TDs, councillors etc. is useful. Also, if there is a special convention then there should be a public protest/presence outside to show opposition to NAMA.

The Greens have had special conventions before and the leadership has convinced a majority to support them. Without knowing how many of us oppose NAMA, they may try to convince Green party members that the Green party is better off by supporting NAMA, .


#89

+1


#90

A dedicated FF list if you want to tailor your email to a party.

aine.brady@oireachtas.ie
bertie.ahern@oireachtas.ie
beverley.flynn@oireachtas.ie
billy.kelleher@eircom.net
bobby.aylward@oireachtas.ie
brian.lenihan@oireachtas.ie
charlie.oconnor@oireachtas.ie
chris.andrews@oireachtas.ie
christy.osullivan@oireachtas.ie
conor.lenihan@oireachtas.ie
cyprian.brady@oireachtas.ie
dara.calleary@oireachtas.ie
darragh.obrien@oireachtas.ie
dick.roche@oireachtas.ie
frank.fahey@oireachtas.ie
john.browne@oireachtas.ie
john.cregan@oireachtas.ie
john.curran@oireachtas.ie
john.mcguinness@oireachtas.ie
john.moloney@oireachtas.ie
john.odonoghue@oireachtas.ie
johnny.brady@oireachtas.ie
maire.hoctor@oireachtas.ie
margaret.conlon@oireachtas.ie
martin.mansergh@oireachtas.ie
mary.orourke@oireachtas.ie
mary_wallace@health.irlgov.ie
mattie.mcgrath@oireachtas.ie
michael.ahern@oireachtas.ie
michael.finneran@oireachtas.ie
michael.kennedy@oireachtas.ie
michael.kitt@oireachtas.ie
michael.mcgrath@oireachtas.ie
michael.moynihan.td@oireachtas.ie
michael.mulcahy@oireachtas.ie
michael.woods@oireachtas.ie
mj.nolan@oireachtas.ie
ned.okeeffe@oireachtas.ie
niall.blaney@oireachtas.ie
niall.collins@oireachtas.ie
noel.ahern@oireachtas.ie
noel.oflynn@oireachtas.ie
noel.treacy@oireachtas.ie
peter.kelly@oireachtas.ie
peter.power@oireachtas.ie
rory.ohanlon@oireachtas.ie
seamus.kirk@oireachtas.ie
sean.connick@oireachtas.ie
sean.fleming@oireachtas.ie
sean.ofearghail@oireachtas.ie
sean.power@oireachtas.ie
thomas.byrne@oireachtas.ie
timmy.dooley@oireachtas.ie
tom.mcellistrim@oireachtas.ie


#91

Thanks for your e-mail. In the first instance, to be honest, no matter what happens or who is in Government there are going to be more tax increases and further severe cutbacks. That is a sad fact.

But in order to help our recovery and everyone’s job prospects the banks need to be able to lend. So they need to get rid of bad debts and source extra working capital.

The question I would ask is what is the alternative option if a good version of NAMA doesn’t go ahead?

The only other option being touted is nationalisation.

Nationalisation will lead to job losses in Irish banks, Irish workers. Nationalisation will make any recovering investment shares held by ordinary people who have some hope of recovering some of their losses in the medium term. Nationalisation will prevent investments being made by foreign investors that will save Irish taxpayers’ money in terms of recapitalisation.

Of course NAMA if done wrong will screw us all. It needs to be done right.
ok so i emailed everyone on the list individually and this is the first one i got back. :exclamation: What do you make of it :question:

The issue is not one of NAMA or not, it is NAMA at what valuation of the developers’ assets. I for one am not inclined to support an over-valuation based on simplistic assumptions as to future values in an era of approaching peak oil and long-term economic stagnation. I want a realistic and fair valuation.

As regarding what valuation the Green Party is seeking, we will be guided by expert advice and will err on the side of caution compared to Fianna Fáil.

There is no valuation proposed or set as of yet, no breakdown of valuation analysis and assumptions and no discussions have taken place, so I cannot say what we believe to be a realistic figure. I am comforted by the fact that NAMA will rely on international expertise, rather than Irish croneyism but it is still up in the air as to what will proceed at this stage.

So the Green Party in summation supports whatever is the best option to try and help the country recover from the mess caused by certain parties. We have no vested interest in this and never took corporate donations from banks and developers unlike FF, FG, the PDs and Labour.

If in our assessment NAMA offers the best opportunity, even with its risks, then, on proper assessment, we will support it. If we think there is an opportunity for something better then we will push for that. We are not inclined simply to support something just because Fianna Fail like it.

Best wishes,


#92

You may want to tell him that the IMF are in fact against Nama in its current form and advocate temporary nationalisation according to this article: independent.ie/opinion/analy … 55204.html


#93

Dan White wrote a piece in the Herald yesterday, he said, in regards to two attempts by foreign banks to by a stake in Irish Banks, the most recent CIBC " Unfortunately what both of these offers have in common is that they would only take place AFTER the government agrees to shoulder the cost of the Irish banks’ bad loans. In other words, while the Irish taxpayer takes all of the pain the new bank shareholders stand to pocket all of the gain"…

Jobs will be lost either way and as for shareholders why protect them? Why take my money so they can profit?


#94

Here is my second email from a green party member, i love that they blame fianna fail in this email

I too am hugely concerned about NAMA.
I worry whether a Fianna-Fail led government which clearly caused the mess, will able to clean it up. And I am concerned whether the Green Party’s input into the drafting of the legislation will be enough to share the risk fairly between the banks and the taxpayers. As a Green Party Councillor, who has only been elected since June, I am very busy at the moment with constituency work, but I have been spending a lot of time reading and trying to understand the arguments for, against and about NAMA.

The majority of the mail I have received so far, like your own, expresses worry and distrust of the proposal and asks me to reject it outright. The emails rarely suggest an alternative. For me, this is knee jerk stuff and doesn’t really do it for me. I hear you when you say what you are against, but what are you for? You surely accept that something needs to be done, but what?

All I know for sure, is that I don’t know enough. I will continue to try to inform myself of the arguments on both sides.

Right now, what I’m hearing on the ground is that the feeling of distrust for the government in general, is extremely widespread. I believe that NAMA is a focal point of this distrust, whether or not the strategy is good for the country in its own right, or not.

Be that as it may, I am very proud to belong to a party as democratic as the Green Party, which listens as closely as we do to the dissenting voice. I trust the bright minds in the parliamentary party no more than the members. I will listen and I will learn and I will trust the decision of the party majority. And I would encourage you to do the same.


#95

Got the exact same one earlier muddles, I’ve answered her back, perhaps you can to.


#96

Email sent to my local TD.


#97

Apart from “out of office” auto-replies I’ve not had one response from a FF TD or senator yet so I’m going to bang off some more mails aimed at turning the screws on FF backbenchers along the lines of “you won’t get elected on the votes of bankers and property developers, if you screw the taxpayer, you are screwing your electorate and you sign your own death warrant and that of FF.”
Lord knows they are thick and they will probably take no notice but if just a few backbenchers cave between now and the end of September it will do the trick.

To help try and get past their email filters I’m going to use some alternative spellings such as NÄMÄ NÅMÅ NÅMÄ NÄMÅ, no doubt they will update their filters quickly but it might help to get some more mails to the target.


#98

Seems to me, from those generic replies (pro and anti), that this operation has been deeply compromised from the beginning.


#99

I think the sheer volume of emails has forced them to do a template stating their position. Their answers are a foregone conclusion - FF -Yes, FG - No Greens - On the fence, no …eh…but…

The point to me is to ask the questions, raise awareness and at least let them know we are awake.


#100

It has been politically managed quite well from each Parties perspective. As to the effect we’ve had, I’d agree it’s been minimal.

We’ve just removed the shroud that surrounded us and now we are a VI group just like any other. Its a professional game, and we are amateurs.

Nate