Public Service Costs - The Elephant in the Room


#1844

I think you meant - the rather well feed pigs (who recently lost some weight) are now waiting anxiously at the trough to gore themselves once more :slight_smile:


#1845

For a few years the Dof and then PER used to published clear and yearly analysis of pay and pensions documents. This ceased under Howlin as soon as the IMF had left, the problem was it was not showing the cost reductions claimed by Howlin (he’d ignore the costs of early retirements). The last one showed pay+pensions increased between 2011 and 2012, i.e. for Howlin it was off-message.

per.gov.ie/wp-content/upload … -20121.pdf

Now we’ve to poke into the databank for figures without full information on the context. Every time I see data on public pay bills now I’m wondering are pensions included, are lump sums included, are supplementary pensions included, are special payoffs to bump up pensions included, are they subtracting the PRD.

The idea of the databank came about when the Irish government couldn’t give figures to the IMF on the number of public employees or what they were really costing. For the databank to now be used as an excuse to not write up consistent yearly analysis is taking the piss.


#1846

Jack the Red is doing the rounds on radio this AM as today is his deadline for talks on a new pay deal. But that deadline is going to be ignored it seems.

Anyways he just railed against the Govt’s of the Celtic Tiger years pouring petrol on the overheating economy through the likes of the SSIA (I’m sure someone can find a quote where the Unions were out in support of that scheme!).
But he did point out that the level of activity in the economy is back to 2008 levels for the past 2 years, that domestic consumption has reach 2008 levels also. And that because of that wages should go there too because we’re into a deflationary cycle otherwise (He didn’t mention the debt levels from now v’s 2008, but hey, he can’t remember everything in his pondering of the Tiger years!)


#1847

rte.ie/news/2016/1123/833923-guerin-report/

Máire Whelan SC, obviously an asshole.

scribd.com/document/3321098 … in-Report1


#1848

Union comrades standing shoulder to shoulder - because it’s trough at the top


#1849

Average remuneration for gardaí ‘in region of €100,000’ when pensions included

irishtimes.com/news/crime-an … -1.2902538


#1850

They’ll be able to afford bigger cars to sleep in!
Or even buy their cornflakes in Waitrose!


#1851

independent.ie/irish-news/he … 80427.html

I assume the facility is staffed if the Alan Kelly was able to visit it. It doesn’t detail how many staff were knocking about the place.


#1852

A bit like that peat power station in Rhode I think it was where the esb had stopped producing power but the staff stayed on drinking tea waiting for a sweetheart deal.
Power to the workers or as Brendan Ogle might say “HASTA LA VICTORIA SIEMPRE”

Why didn’t Alan Kelly bring this to the public’s attention back when he was Minister and spotted it first? Didn’t want to rock the boat on another gravy train in his constituency…like the extra ghost trains and buses he laid on.


#1853

Rhode not Rhodes.

Yes, Minster had this storyline about an empty hospital not treating patients 30 to 35 years ago with militant staff to boot.


#1854

What does it cost to recruit someone to head Fáilte Ireland?
What a waste of money.


#1855

I can’t link it - but a story in yesterday’s Sunday Times reported that “Bereavement Leave” has been quite dramatically extended for Civil Servants following “negotiations” with the unions.

Death of Spouse or partner: increased from five to 20 days. (fourfold increase)

Death of close family member including parents, siblings, grandparents, grandchildren: increased from three to five days. (This leave also applies to in-laws and “immediate relatives” of cohabiting partners.)

Death of uncles, aunts, nieces, nephews: one day off which can be increased to up to five days in “exceptional” circumstances.

A quick, off-the top-of-my-head calculation has revealed that, had I been a Civil Servant under these rules, I would have had at least two months fully-paid leave over the last ten years in order to “grieve.”


#1856

If this report is accurate then the extended bereavement leave is way way out of line with the norm for bereavement leave in the private sector even in top quartile companies.


#1857

It’s accurate alright - full details here:
impact.ie/civil-service-bere … increased/


#1858

I was looking this stuff up a couple of weeks ago (so “old rules”), it’s normally pretty public information.
Here’s the 2009 circular I referred to: circulars.gov.ie/pdf/circular/fi … 009/22.pdf

Actually, added 2017 to the search terms and found this:
circulars.gov.ie/pdf/circular/per/2017/01.pdf
haven’t digested it but do see “twenty” working days there for first category… I’ll let others read further

(edit: HiFi, hadn’t seen your post as I hit send. Still, the links above are effectively the internal circulars sent to managers/staff within the Civil Service to implement these changes, so probably useful.)


#1859

Ah, the old exceptional circumstances. Bets on that nearly every event will be exceptional! Just like nearly every civil servant whose performance was exceptional when doing performance reviews a few years back.


#1860

The ----------- is agreed in principle , subject to discussion at local level .

The ----------- will only be granted in exceptional circumstances

Public Service Unions have been selling the above nonsense to gullible managers for years. Of course what can you expect when the managers are in a branch of the same union as the the staff.

Monty Python eat your heart out


#1861

20 days leave (some taken immediately and maybe some taken over 6 months) to deal with the emotional and practical impact of the loss of a spouse seems quite humane. Having seen this at close quarters in recent times I would say that having some days to use when kids don’t want to face school or need to be collected early etc. would be very important. As would time to chase probate etc. A week’s leave hardly seems adequate in my opinion, it barely allows for the burial and the immediate logistical issues.


#1862

Of course the early loss of a spouse is a huge event in any life , but a weeks special leave is a very humane response by any employer. If the individual is in need of further time off , then there are many possible options

  • take annual leave
  • take sick leave
  • start late / finish early on flexi time to allow for school drop offs / collection.

#1863

The 20 days will, presumably, only be availed of once (if at all) in their career for the vast majority of civil servants. And even then, they may choose not to take the whole 20 days. Some public servants take the piss on sick days and all the rest, but most, I think, are fairly diligent.