Scalding comments on the public service

rte.ie/news/2007/0524/business.html

I just read: “ISME” and start laughing… :stuck_out_tongue:

It is a bloody joke though. I’d love to see some of those public servants having their cosy salaries benchmarked downwards in line with the private sector.

It really does beggar belief. How does a system implemented only 7 or 8 years ago to bring the public sector in line with the private sector have them floating about 25% above the industry average already?!?!? And whats more, how does it not even consider pension entitlements?

lol

did ya like the topic headline “scalding”

:stuck_out_tongue:

Seriously though see how the nurses got something out of their dispute when the truckers didnt really generate any sort of a dispute when they werent allowed to cripple the M50.
If the truckers were allowed use green diesel like the tractors for instance (in a perfect world, this saving would be passed onto the customer ENTIRELY :smiley: ) this would benefit the entire economy - if it translated into cheaper goods etc.
The nurses get more pay inflation keeps going up, then they are running to stand still.

If I were a trucker I would probably be blocking the m50 everyday until pay and conditions were better, if I were a nurse I probably have been on a work to rule until 8am this morning

:smiley:

Everyone is looking out for themselves (and always will) including the politicians who are supposed to be looking out for us

They already are! :wink:

Actually I can see pensions being a major headache in the future

The unions will fight tooth and nail to ensure that pensions remain firmly outside the benchmarking process - it’s a sacred cow of the public service, always has been, always will be.

Now, it’ll be a major headache for the rest of us whose taxes will have to subsidise the defined benefits of these pensions, especially since the defined benefit is a percentage of final salary, a salary already grossly inflated by the aforementioned benchmarking system.

Basically, public servants win twice from a benchmarking award. The rest of us will just have to muddle on paying for their pension as well as our own.

I suggest everyone joins the civil service, then we’ll all be well off!! :laughing:

Aren’t most building firms represented by the ISME?

I find it extremely hard to believe that when you factor in the earnings of the construction company bosses, the figure is less than what public servants get.

I’ve worked in two multi-billion euro multinationals based in Ireland and I noticed some things about upper management: they get paid big bucks but they’re all out the door at 4:55pm.

Since I joined the public service, I can count on one hand the number of upper management people who don’t stay slogging away at their desks until 7pm.

And they’d get paid the same if they were out the door at 5 day in day out; I make that out to be the taxpayer getting six to ten thousand euros of work done for free per manager per annum. Their families’ loss is the taxpayer’s gain.

It’s not exactly a safe assumption that you’re getting ripped off. We in the public service know we’re getting good money, and we work accordingly harder.

well said , and as regards the pensions, correct me if I am on wrong, but was there not a time when all large companies provided defined benefit pensions? Then they realised that they could roll back from defined benefit schemes and get away with it… It seemed to me that weak private sector unions allowed this to happen whereas people in the public sector had strong unions and managed to keep this basic right. I suppose the private sector employees have all been fooled into acting ‘for the good of the company’ and for the ‘good of us all at bank plc’ when really all they have done is weaken their own employment conditions and made the CEO a richer man just my opinion as a person who has experience of both employers

That’s a bit naive. Many if not most private sector workers work in companies that face extreme competition, particularly from countries in Eastern Europe, China & India. There isn’t a programming job in this country that can’t be outsourced if the price is too high and that applies to a lot of occupations. If your boss approaches you and says you have a choice of either reducing pension benefits or losing your job, you know what you’ll take.

Watching public sector workers who have jobs guaranteed for life “benchmarking” themselves against those people working in the private sector is a bit rich. Personally I think that a public sector defined benefit pension plan, plus the security of job tenure is worth at least 30-40% more than the private sector equivalent.

fair point as regards companies facing competition from eastern europe and china/india.
It is hardly the fault of the public sector if they work with an employer who does not make such move or lose it demands. Public sector jobs cannot be outsourced to china (imagine trying to get your kids to school on warsaw each day!!) and as such the public sector employees use this as a strong bargaining point i presume.
At the end of the day each union does what it can for its own people and I dont think we should blame public sector unions for getting the best they can for their own hey, maybe it is unfair but sure thats life.
I just feel, from when i worked in the private sector everyone was into their careers and moving on , maybe at the expense of not wanting to upset the boss etc. Now, it is hard to over come the culture in a plc but if private sector employees fought for their own rights a bit more maybe they would not have lost the benefits.
You say its hard to face down a boss who offers you the stark choice outlined but a bit harder negotiation might see private sector workers better, rather than ‘oh yeah fair enough boss’

And those that didn’t do so quickly enough, like GM, are doomed now. Any pension scheme which isn’t fully funded by the time the employee retires will come back to haunt the company, if any real competition emerges in future. So it is with countries and their public sector employees, over a longer timescale.

Some private sector unions realised that backrupting their companies achieves little, others did a ‘GM’. Those in the public sector are happy to bankrupt their countries, once they’re all right jack. And i’d say it more down to weak governments (who didn’t want the hassle on their watch) than anything else. And since TDs / ministers get the same benefits as the public sector by default, they’re not exactly in a rush cut their own throats either.

You think GM / Ford spending over $1500 per car sold on retired employees is in anyone’s interest except the retired employees (and of course toyota). And who’s going to pay them in 5 years time, when GM is bust?

Am a public servant myself and I couldn’t agree more with some of the comments here.

Two points. 1.Until govt starts to sack the wasters (and there are a hell of a lot of them) public service will have a bad rap

2.big misconception on pensions as I see it My wife works private sector and on retirement she will have her fund and govt old age pension to live off. On my retirement I will have half salary 40/80ths however will be unable to claim OAP so my admitedly generous pension is less than appears as govt as employer is only paying difference of OAP and pension not the entire ammount as most people are entitled to a contrib or non- contrib pension

Im in the public service now

:laughing:

But Im still going back to college in Sept! Still holding by my plan to (eventually) flee this country !!!
8)

Irish Independent

Irish Examiner

rte.ie/business/2007/0810/cso2.html

As am I, brother. One word - “Bombproof”… 8)