Stamp Duty Bill - Details Published

rte.ie/business/2007/0620/cowen.html

Blue Horseshoe

What a load of nonsense.

They didn’t make the bands incremental so that when you move into a new band you pay the higher rate only on the portion which is above the threshold.

They didn’t do anything about the LUNACY of the divorce/separation situation. Where a person can regain their first time buy status only if their partner buys them out of the property and continues to live in the property.

In otherwords in a family where there’s enough money for one person to be bought out (thus giving that person funds to buy a new house) they get First Time Buyer Relief, while in a family where there are insufficient funds and they must sell the house, neither partner gets the relief.

They did nothing to make it cheaper for those living in big houses whose kids have moved away to trade down. They should have exempted people from stamp duty if selling a house worth more than they were buying, this would free up under utilised family homes, allowing retirees to move into smaller houses and apartments, and enabling young famililes to find houses.

The only positive aspect of this is that they’ve finally removed the sop to developers to subsidise new houses which made them more attractive than pre owned houses. This along with other incentives like section 23 did contributed a great deal to the level of construction in Ireland, despite the ever increasing number of vacant homes.

They have taken their grubby fingers a tiny bit out of the market and as a result there might be some increase in market efficiency.

For the first time this week I started to see Irish Properties available at prices that were approaching what I would consider reasonable. And I think even those properties have a lot further to fall.

Where is this wave of FTB’s going to come from to snap up these properties and save the day?

Now that Stamp Duty has been finalised, and the new government has been elected, anyone want to predict the next great event that will explain the lack of desire to purchase Irish Property.

Will people be waiting until the next buying season in September? Or perhaps they’ll wait until the next Budget to see if there will be further changes on Stamp Duty, or a new SSIA scheme. Or maybe they’ll hold off until after the World Cup?

Keep your eyes peeled, expect an excuse shortly.

-Rd

Jim Power was on the six one news and I was surprised at how bearish he was in direct contrast with his outlook before the election.
He said that there would be a small boost to the market and that this would not last very long and then the market would continue its downward trend.
He came straight out and said the current slump had very little to do with stamp duty and said that it was the interest rates that were the main issue.
He went on to say that interest rates were expected to keep on rising this year and next.
This is by far the most bearish outlook I’ve heard from Jim Power, and he sounded very downbeat.
Marion, the Sherry Fitzgerald economist gave the stamp duty changes a very luke warm welcome also and said that they don’t go far enough to make any real difference as they are going to benefit very few people.
Again I was surprised at her downbeat response which is also in direct contrast to what she has said earlier this year.
I think reality is starting to hit home with a lot of commentators.
Even Comical wasn’t his usual upbeat self.

So if I’m understanding this correctly the strategy was. Claim that the fundamentals are fine and then if only something could be done about Stamp Duty the market would be strong as ever (believing in their heart that nothing would be done and they could go on blaming stamp duty indefinitely).

Shock horror, something is done about Stamp Duty, so they have to sheepishly start acknowledging that it might have been the fundamentals after all.

Sounds to me like the men who claim they’d be willing to have the babies if only it were possible. Imagine the look on their faces if science made it happen.

-Rd

:open_mouth:

I’m shocked too, and It could be that if I go further than looking at pictures on a computer screen I might find they need another 50K of work done, so I’m not trowing a party here, or claiming there has been a huge move.

But the reality is that Waterford which has the highest vacancy rate in the country as far as I know, now has 3 and 4 bed houses in the city center for around 175-250K.

Doing a search for Waterford City, 3 Bed minimum, max price 250K returns 21 properties.

I don’t ever before recall opening up an Irish property website and seeing not just one, but lots of listings for properties, and thinking, that’s not too far away from what I’d consider offering.

It’s not that I’d be excited about paying the prices that are listed, but with things being the way they are I think a lower offer from someone who isn’t waiting to sell another property and who can move fast might be rewarded with at a good price.

Now the only problem is…Who’d want to live in Waterford City?
As I’ve said in the past, If Ireland ever needs an enema, that’s where it will be inserted.

(Boy that comment is going to haunt me if I ever try to get elected to anything in the South East). :wink:

-Rd

Ok let me get this straight. Its been abolished with limits still attached.

Trevor Sargent said he’d resign if the Greens went into Government.
I dont’ think I’d be wrong in assuming the most people interpreted this as a signal that the Greens going into government with FF from the leaders point of view wouldn’t happen as it would mean failiure, it was the kind of “I’ll eat my hat if X happens”.

yet Trevor Sargent did literally what he said he would do. No one ever counted on that one eh!

I see this as being the situation with Fianna Fall & The SD promise. They’ve done exatly what they said they’d do, Abolish Stamp for First Time Buyers. That doesn’t preclue them from having a few catches.

The electorate once more has been hood winked by FF. Its FF policy to play footsie with the truth.

Some EA was on the Today FM with Matt Cooper and said the market was dead in Waterford and that prices were falling, not just him but all other EA’s in his area were saying the same thing to him. Matt read out some press release from some auctioneers body which said the market would pick up now etc. but he said it in a mocking way as if to say “this is total VI bullsh1t but sure we will read it out for a laugh”

I did a search towards the end of last year and there was in excess of 750 properties to either buy or rent in the city. This in relation to it’s population is very excessive :open_mouth:

Can’t agree here at all. Waterford is a fine city with plenty of amenities - city , coastal beaches , an airport and top class road access all adding to a high quality of life. A second bridge is also under construction I believe :slight_smile: What the city doesn’t have is investment. In fact all of the big employers like Waterford Crystal , Hasbro , Bausch & Lomb are on the wain. So even if house prices were halved it still wouldn’t be attractive as there are no jobs there.

about what time was that interview with the EA on at plaudit?

I think it was the first topic after the 5 o’clock news.

Waterford is one to watch people. They lost alot of jobs recently. Their biggest employers.

rte.ie/business/2007/0314/jobs.html
munster-express.ie/061117/news1.html

Seriously - where is the bottom for prices when hundreds of people are made redundant in such a small city, combined with oversupply? They also have the largest vacancy rate plus they have a “roaring” construction industry.
Where is the bottom because I just cant see it from here.

ah cool thanks , just listening to it now

Even though I grew up in Kilkenny, Waterford was the nearest town.
Outside of the city it’s fine. There are places out near the coast that would be ok to live in and the road network out to Tramore etc has been improved a lot. Also out near the Hospital they have basically built a new town center.

I wouldn’t call the road access from South Kilkenny top class, but that could be as much to do with both counties arguing over who owns the turf than anything else.

My favourite memory of Waterford was catching a plane to the UK. I learned that even after buying my ticket there would be a 6 Euro “Airport charge” when I boarded the plane. This pissed me off, and I thought it was typical of everything I hated about Ireland.

So I brought along a bag with 600 pennies that I’d collected over the years, I wrote “6 Euro” on the side of the Bag and I told them to count it if they wanted to. They didn’t but they took the bag.

I consider Waterford a small town rather than a city, the lack of choice frustrates me. One Cinema, One Bookshop, One Bowling Alley.

If as happened with me you get ripped off (i.e. short changed) by the cinema and they then deny it even though you’re still standing at the counter, you literally have nowhere else to go.

But I’m off in my own little world here, you don’t need to know all this. Bottom line, small towns depress me.

-Rd

dont be so selfish and post us a linky!!!

:astonished:

Here you go

radioireland.ie/lastword/lastword.html

in particular this link radioireland.ie/lastword/2062007-17.wmv

literally starts on property from the get go

The election is over, the blatant lying and fearmongering worked, the Builders Party are back in power for another few years…so the VIs can afford to tell the truth…for once.

The electorate were blatantly scammed in the 2002 election. They’ve just been shamelessly scammed again. Just how stupid are the Irish electorate anyway?

Not as stupid as the morons who thought they’d pull another stroke on us a few weeks back and are now inheriting the (relatively, and let’s look at where the US economy was in 1979 folks) worst economic horizon since Mr. Haughey talked of ‘looking at the books’ and ‘tightening our belts’ in 1980.

It was the best election result for those of us who welcome change in, what is supposed to be a democracy after all. FF to get a good shafting in the next election (they’ve set themselves up for this baby in the same way they escaped being found out during the 80s. Not for the want of trying to get into power on their part) and practically everyone else will stand back laughing at the likes of Clowen pretending to have ‘expertise at managing the economy’. Maybe McCreevy. A loss after Bertie shafted him. Not Clowen.

Clowen said this evening that it was important that FTBers get on to the first rung of the property ladder as soon as possible.
This is some set up alright.
Clowen must never have heard of health and safety rules. :unamused: