The Fleming Group and ACCBank

provost edit: changed title to: The Fleming Group and ACCBank

from todays IT:
irishtimes.com/newspaper/frontpage/2009/0721/1224250998217.html

Would someone who knows stuff care to comment on why one bank (ACC) would oppose examinership and another (Anglo) be in favour? Is Is Anglo’s stance in the best interests of the shareholders (ie us?)

there’s a thread discussing how it could be about NAMA: viewtopic.php?f=50&t=23585

I posted in the ACC thread the headline in the Indo is that 2 white nights are looking at investing €bn and saving the 650 jobs, …Spin it keeps Ireland turning

Thanks - saw that. There’s so much happening so fast, and it’s all interconnected, that it’s hard to know which thread to put stuff.
Is it all a big poker game for these guys - are they waiting to see who folds first? Or are they sitting in their gated country mansions, knowing that It Has All Been Taken Care Of and will soon blow over? Or are there tense and desperate meetings going on with banks, other developers and politicians all over the place? Somehow the last seems doubtful - some rumours surely would have surfaced?

Kinda funny, isn’t it, that dour old slowpoke Agricultural Credit Corporation should turn out to be the shiny Pin after all!

I know its hardly this straightforward, as any foreign player could have made a move, etc, but there is a morsel of irony in the fact that the Gov only sold ACC a few years back and now they’re threatening to derail the whole ‘plan’.

is there another thread discussing this court case today, I’ve tried the search engine, but couldn’t find one
Can we expect appeals in this also?

Fleming firms get court protection

irishtimes.com/newspaper/breaking/2009/0921/breaking54.htm

preferable for them alright

Rescue plan drawn up for Fleming Group -> sbpost.ie/news/ireland/rescu … 44953.html

Once again we have that figure of 25% for non-performing loans. The aspirational 50% figure is just that, aspirational.

Based on my semi-random calculations given that Zoe was also ‘worth’ 25% of its debt:

NAMA 77 bn original loan value
60% non-performing: 46.2 bn
40% performing: 30.8 bn
Recovery rate on performing: 100%
Recovery rate on non-performing: 25%
NAMA loss: 11.65 bn

But let’s suppose that over time we get to (which I believe will be best case):
Recovery rate on performing: 80%
Recovery rate on non-performing: 40%
NAMA loss: 10.88 bn

Now let’s suppose that we instead get (which I believe will be worst case):
Recovery rate on performing: 60%
Recovery rate on non-performing: 20%
NAMA loss: 26.28 bn

irishtimes.com/newspaper/fin … 93497.html

Strange bit at the end , someone will allegedly ‘invest’ €4bn, get the hell out of it willye :smiley:

I’ve heard third hand that the Rabo executives are flippin furious with the Irish ACC management and with the ACC customers.
They are Dutch and they’re pissed off
calvinist instincts are gone off the scale

They just want no more bullshit and to sell off everything as soon as possible for whatever they can get.
They aren’t prepared to listen to any more fairy stories about the fundamentals.

Fleming begs for early court decision -> rte.ie/business/2009/1119/fleming.html

Fleming rescue plan could cost ACC over €20m -> sbpost.ie/news/ireland/flemi … 46223.html

Who do i believe in this saga - funnily enough ACC rather than anyone else

irishtimes.com/newspaper/fin … 36695.html

Good idea, lets use taxpayers cash to keep 137 jobs in a company that is insolvent and has no future. Never thought of that.

(Gets up to bring in another basket of turf)

Slean agus beannacht, Pete, you old sod.