The Stick Approach - OECD says 'Cut the Dole'

‘Cut the dole and get jobless back to work’ to tackle crisis

The didn’t say cut the dole.

They said reduce the payments over time if someone stays on the dole.

I was waiting to see who would post this. I resisted doing it myself.

Yes - absolutely. Address the issue that people on the dole just get lazy and do not want to work for the increment between what they get for having to do nothing and what they get for having to work full time.

Remember that the dole has two aspects:

  1. The person gets money

  2. The person does not have to do anything to get the money

The dole means you are paying people to be idle, quite literally.

Therefore any possible job is measured against:

  1. The difference in the two amounts - increments between wage vs dole

  2. The difference in free time

In theory any difference (after additional costs of working - such as travel costs) should make talking a job the only decision. But because the additional factor in introdu ced into the decision-making process, the process becomes more complex and leads to different outcomes.

If dole payments were made subject to having to attend a location or be present for a similar amount of time that a job would involve, the decision point would be made easier.

You cannot make people work but you can put in place factors that influence outcomes. If you cannot address the issue of lots of spare time, then you need to address the money difference.

Numbers of jobs are elastic. If more people are available, then more jobs will be generated.

How frequently have business said that they cannot get people when offering a reasonable wage?

Its pissing into the wind without an end to JLC rates, remember these: … 82620.html … 59045.html … r_embedded

and of course: … 20723.html

WTF? :confused:

About 3 times that I’ve heard of.

alot still wont be able to offer a “reasonable wage” unless we reform the labour court system!!!
Its why we have such a large black market
Its like removing rent relief while NAMA withholds properties

I heard on the wireless yesterday that 17 unemployed people who have refused retraining opportunities have had their payment reduced. It’s part of the “work for dole” scheme to encourage people to come off benefits and engage in training or work placements. It was announced in last December’s budget. … 44586.html

I heard the end of that piece too but forgot about it afterwards. Thanks for reminding me. I thought this story would have got a bit more attention.

Hmm, if only Ms Burton had some sort of power, like if she was a member of the government or something… Ah well, if wishes were fishes.

Edit: Fixed quote tag…

why would you want to do the WPP or any other govt scheme when it reduces your chances of getting a job!! … 2288.shtml

Because you’d be forced to under government guidelines! (the bad IMF made us do it)

On the WPP thing, I’m not surprised it has this effect because as an employer myself I’d question the intelligence or sanity of someone presenting a CV with this on it. I’d favour a carrot and stick approach for the dole by making several different categories depending on the individual.
For the long term unemployable underclasses or younger people who have worked very little or not at all a subsistence rate of about €70 a week should be sufficient. For those with a long employment history I would treat their unemployment as a job in terms of their tax-ie allow the expenses incurred in searching for work such as transport costs, telephone, broadband, a portion of their domestic bills etc. to be deductible against what they’ve already paid. They would also receive a more generous rate of say €250 a week, with that amount reducing monthly for about a year until they reach the subsistence rate.
I’d introduce free public transport passes for anyone on the dole (except the subsistence people) from the first bus/train until 8PM.

Seriously lads are you sayin’ that there’s 440K jobs just waiting to be filled out there if it weren’t for the dole? The way I see it the dole is holding back the floodgates on the unrest.

If you talk to under-25 year olds who are mostly on the scratcher, they are angry but the few bob in the pocket is placating them for now. Remove that in the morning and it won’t be pretty.

A good reason to remove it then. Get them angry and change the system.
I’m currently living in a country that has no dole.
The streets are full of people doing whatever they can to make ends meet.
Amazing how imaginative and enterprising people can get when they have to.
I’m too embarrased to tell the local school teachers and policemen that people on the dole earn more in Ireland than they do.

Goodness, does the Government know this. Quickly, raise the dole to €500 per week to ensure that we keep all of the young people who are unemployed “placated”.

We need to cut the dole immediately to the equivalent of what is paid in Northern Ireland. Bankrupt countries like Ireland cannot pay dole which is amongst the highest in Europe. Unfortunately we have gutless government officials at every level so I do not expect this to change until the looming crisis of default sets upon us. And this my friends is inevitable!

And of course there is not a single word about cutting the housing allowance. It’s getting harder and harder every day to keep up on industrial average after taxes, pension, levies and union dues when rent is nearly half of the income just to give a bail out to SCD rulling class.

Bankrupt countries like Ireland cant afford to pay for a lot of things. Arguing that cutting the dole would incentivise people to work harder to get a job is largely nonesense. If the jobs were there people would take them but they aint.

In any event, my guess is that the most affected group, the under 25s, are being subsidised by their parents in most cases. Cut the dole and you will just be shifting the cost to them.

Up to the mid 1970s in Ireland, there existed regular Employment Period Orders. These were statutory instruments passed annually that disallowed people from claiming Unemployment Assistance for intervals from typically April to November. These were typically single males with no dependents living outside county or other borough, urban district or towns or some offshore islands.

The idea was that there was plenty of temporary work available, either in Ireland or elsewhere.

A simple measure, now a piece of history long forgotten, but it was very effective. The numbers claiming unemployment dropped significantly every year. No one died.

I’d like to see them cut the working week and share out the work that is there around more people. Current workers would have less money but more time and more people would be employed. I would have no problem training up someone to share my job.

You couldn’t do that, why it’s my right to work 60hour weeks, doing what you suggest sounds like progress. Can’t be having that!