Tracker mortgages scandal - but who are the culprits?


#101

From the discussions further up the thread it seems that while some cases were clear cut many more were much more ambiguous. I doubt the banks would have fought this as far as the high court if they didn’t think they had some legal argument.


#102

Examiner headline “ECB: Ireland’s Central Bank must enforce tracker mortgage redress”

irishexaminer.com/ireland/ec … 64619.html

Tough talk on trackers from the ECB?

Of course not. The Examiner can’t read or is being fed a line.

Here’s the actual letter.
google.cz/url?sa=t&source=w … prSiQA-EmK

Short version: you Irish made such a hash of bank supervision, the EU had to centralise the prudential part (i.e. any threat to the system) but the trackers are just a matter of consumer protection. We don’t care so long as your banks are fully provisioned for the costs of compensation / sanctions (i.e. so long as they can squeeze the costs out of their other customers or shareholders)


#103

David Hall spouting cock-up this and cock-up that on Newstalk at the moment.

People are still being overcharged, and at Christmas too
and there are more cases, now 33,700 mortgages
Central Bank forces lenders to admit 13,600 more tracker victims overcharged and breakdown of figures


#104

and breakdown of figures

I see your 37,600 and the Examiner says up to 40,000 at a cost of 1 Billion plus :sick:
irishexaminer.com/ireland/to … 64789.html


#105

Now the falling BOI share price since July, despite a €1bn profit, makes more sense.


#106

Caught the end of a radio show where one listener asked a question which makes me think this is the tip of the iceberg.

They were on a tracker and missed one payment, the bank took the tracker off them and put them on SVR. They wanted to know if they had a case, the expert was surprised that they would do this over one missed payment but if they did then he felt they had had a case.

They also put over an interesting point. When you fall behind and your rate is 1% you feel it’s solviable but when it’s 5% you feel it’s not, you are also treated very differently by the bank.

There could be a lot of people who handed back the keys after coming off fixed onto SVR and getting into trouble who should have had a tracker. What if their house was sold and debit cristalied.

Will they be looking for compensation equivalent to a similar property in today’s prices, if so the longer the banks stall the worse it will be for the banks and taxpayer in the long run.


#107

CentralBank - Cost of tracker scandal approaching €1bn
One bank has 500 employees working on their redress scheme alone!
We are effectively subsiding these banks through our unlimited guarantee + other subventions for this scandal


#108

Because of a movement to an interest rate (marginal enough stuff surely), some in default will get bailed out and get the increase in the property price since the default/repossesion… According to Derville Rowland. In some cases this is looking like a stroke for the CBI to implent a nama beag.


#109

What is the role of the Central Bank of Ireland, is it’s job to protect the Banks. What is the role of An Garda in white collar chrime. Is the Central Bank the dog that dosn’t Bark. Is there too much Academia in the Central Bank.


#110

The direction I saw today was : Big bad Banks must be hammered until there is nothing left, but individual responsibility for taking out and paying back a loan? well we plead diminished responsibility.
There are even people claiming they were under the impression they were on a tracker, but weren’t and now they claim they should have had a tracker. Presumably 10 years after the event. It’s a scandal alright, but not always in the one sided way portrayed.
Why would anyone enter this mortgage market when you expose yourself to this circus.


#111

The Examiner has details from three major lenders, BoI AIB and PTSB, about redress and compensation payments thus far.

irishexaminer.com/ireland/4 … 66052.html

Ulster Bank “will be the main reason customers wrongly charged will have to wait until June for compensation and their cases to be resolved”.

Long way to go before this scandal is put to bed.


#112

independent.ie/business/per … 22138.html


#113

Many were unaware of their rights and now will get a windfall.

irishtimes.com/news/ireland … -1.3379846

Check your mortgage contract.You might be collecting from your bank. Sweet 8)

As good as a slip and fall in Tescos and you won’t have to give up sports.


#114

Galway couple overcharged by €1.23m in tracker scandal
The overcharging reduces their overall indebtedness from about €5.8m to €4.5m
John and Christine Foye of Milltown, Co Galway, were overcharged by KBC on loans across a portfolio of investment properties. They were incorrectly moved off a fixed interest rate to a higher variable rate instead of a lower interest tracker rate tied to the ECB rate.
The bank has offered the Foyes almost €380,000 in compensation.
The sudden switch to higher repayments pushed the couple into insolvency as they struggled to cope with making increased monthly repayments of between €20,000-€30,000. Unable to cover the repayments, the couple eventually lost their properties to a bank-appointed receiver and had to apply for a financial rescue deal known as a personal insolvency arrangement.

How many properties did the small-town couple have to owe €4.5m?
And how many more people borrowed so much to ‘invest’?


#115

why are they being offered 380k against an overcharge of 1.23m?

assume they are writing back the 1.23m and offering compo on top?


#116

I like this piece:


#117

They got the overcharge written off their debt. €5.8m - €1.23m = €4.5m + €380k compo


#118

This example just goes to show that the incorrect application of the rate did relatively little in the scheme of things.

By the looks of it they would have been insolvent on a negative interest rate!

The main cause is still the spectacular overborrowing (facilitated by the banks) by many individuals in the years to 2008.


#119

They didn’t have a tracker but for some reason they should have got a tracker after they lost by their fixed rate mortgage.

NB “incorrectly” , not “illegally”. Who decides?


#120

irishtimes.com/business/hav … -1.3415427
Irish Time personal finance Q&A

this idiocy is no longer surprising