By arguing that I’m personalising the debate, while claiming that you are arguing about societal factors.
I’ve seen no evidence presented of societal harm. What I have seen are people who appear to be individually upset / bothered by assertions of trans rights/recognition, but who aren’t being open about “owning” their reaction.
I expected that response, insert simpsons pic here
But can you answer the question, how many children claiming to be trapped in the wrong body do we need for you to change your opinion ?
One per school, one per class ?
The fact the number of children claiming to be trans can fluctuate so much is a dead give away that the entire thing is pure bullshit, give me a large budget and some good cartoon illustrators and I can get children obsessed with Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles, give obese blue haired feminists control of the education system and we will get a growing number of trans children, what was it the Jesuits used to say about children
And this is how the whole thing will eventually collapse, its probably a decade away, but the number of people angry about what has been done to them will be just too large to ignore
@Col. Max Pyatnitski
I asked you where? Show me.
" while claiming that you are arguing about societal factors." Where do I claim this? Show me.
Afaik, I just criticized your faulty methods of argumentation (the unsolicited psychopathologizing).
Since you seem to be such an expert, after watching all those youtube videos you recommended, perhaps you could define for us what are these “trans rights”, and perhaps you could explain how they differs from the universal human rights?
It’s a man called Jorge Alcantar, a drag queen who goes by the performance name of Xochi Mochi. He is reading at a Los Angeles children’s public library in an ongoing event called Drag Queen Story Hour which advertises itself thus:
Xochi Mochi tweeted after the event:
The general case we are talking about is the dissemination of the idea (including to young children) that biological sex and gender are independently determined. That’s stupid, wrong, and damaging, whoever teaches it.
But a drag queen is not a transexual.
Most drag-queens would unambiguously identify as men, albeit they wear a particular form of “female” garb, often as part of performance. Cross dressing in performance has a very long history, but probably seen with highest profile today in drag or pantomime (widow twanky etc.,)
Which sounds fine.
And children (even children with no transexual tendency) often do play with gender, identity, make believe, etc., both as toddlers and as they get older and form their identity.
what do you think happened? That they “caught the gay/trans/whatever” by listening to the man in a dress read a story? I don’t really see the problem. I can think of multiple experiences (my own and friends’) from very normal Irish schooling that sound more damaging.
That’s a bald assertion to make without evidence, and ill informed both on biological and cultural fronts.
they become fans of the turtles, I think you’re overestimating the impact.
when you just throw random things like “obese” and “blue haired” into the mix it doesn’t signify serious discussion, it sounds more like hysterical schoolyard name calling. If I give the benefit of the doubt are you saying?
obese people want to turn our children trans
blue-haired people want to turn our children trans
it’s possible the words don’t mean what you think they mean as…
Not really a flaw in argumentation. Though it may be unhelpful and / or inappropriate.
Basically there shouldn’t be.
But the question is what rights are you trying to deny them?
That’s not really the way to use that.
The sequence we’ve got is:
You: Trans-rights/ trans-activism should be stopped as it is causing harm
Me: I don’t see the harm
You: it is causing harm
Me: you just keep asserting that, but you’ve shown no evidence
You: argument from ignorance
I’m anyway not saying that there is absolutely no harm. Lots of things we probably all agree with cause harm. I think electricity is good, and electrification positive. People get killed every year by electricity. But on balance it’s positive.
@Col. Max Pyatnitski
“should be stopped as it is causing harm” - I never said this. " it is causing harm" - or this
It seems to me you are painting my comments with your own impressions without really understanding what has been said.
“But the question is what rights are you trying to deny them?” You? Explain.
Apologies then, I had understood from your posts that you had an issue with current developments in transexual rights. But if that’s not the case, then of course you’ll find my responses confusing or misinformed.
And of course from the above, I could infer that you have a position on the matter.
I’ll predict right now that you’ll come back offended that I’m inferring things about you
in fact you’ll probably take umbrage at that prediction,
and that one…
just make some inferences, then I can be offended when you get them wrong or if you infer things that are true but which I don’t want to have pointed out or whatever…
And your point? His stated agenda is “normalize all the letters in LGBTQIA+ in everyday lives”. I also am slightly doubting your level of knowledge here. For a start, you keep misspelling transsexual. And you seem to be implying that all transgender people must be transsexual which is wrong.
And that’s an equally bald response without evidence. My assertion doesn’t really need evidence – the idea that a man can be a woman or vice versa is a simple logical contradiction.
@Col. Max Pyatnitski
IMHO, it seems you are not interested in having a rational discussion on this topic as evidenced by your use of the accusatory inversion & distortion.
"just make some inferences, then I can be offended when you get them wrong "
Perhaps this a question of belief for you; and since, I think there’s no arguing with beliefs, all I can do now is wish you good luck in your beliefs.
Identity = the fact of being who or what a person or thing is.
Persona = the aspect of someone’s character that is presented to or perceived by others.
“an “identity” you taken on/assume”, that would be called a persona.
No matter the power of the ego, and how much it wishes, the persona cannot become the identity.
(The Latin root of the word identity is idem, which means same.)
I haven’t the slightest idea what you mean by “OK with”. You presumably know what you meant, so I’m happy to answer if you care to elaborate.
Do you mean that you pretend (for example) to be a women when you are not? Why should anyone else go along with your pretense, let alone be forced to? And that’s even ignoring the potential for psychological and physical injury to the pretender.