US - Protests, Riots, Looting and Insurgency?


#45

In terms of the predominantly black communities, I think Trumps plan/promise was/is to improve the overall economy and in the process improve the economic prospects for those in these mostly poorer communities.

I’m not an expert on race relations in the USA, but I think everyone should listen to what Thomas Sowell has to say on these matters and how they relate to the economy.
https://twitter.com/ThomasSowell

Racism is not dead. But it is on life-support, kept alive mainly by the people who use it for an excuse or to keep minority communities fearful or resentful enough to turn out as a voting bloc on election day.

— Thomas Sowell (@ThomasSowell) June 3, 2020

#46

Feeling a spell of cognitive dissonance perhaps, well thank goodness and let’s hope it stays that way rather than perform to expectations, but we ain’t out of the woods yet.

There are are few but one contributing factor that may be ensuring a low fatality rate thus far, are the actions taken by the Turmp admin with mass arrests, or an ongoing security sweep across the US, cleaning and removing violent and heavily armed drug gangs, such as MS-13 in advance of current events, so that they are naturalised or removed entirely form the picture.

One search reveals a net 1K+ arrests of some seriously dangerous, highly organised, well armed ultra violent groups.

96 MS-13 Members Arrested in New York in Largest Takedown of Gang

600+ arrests of CJNG cartel as a result of Trump’s executive order

341 arrests made in massive gang crackdown

The speculation is that the motivation goes beyond simply a war on drugs and behind these mass arrests and operations (probably still ongoing as per Gen. Miley’s promise) of these gangs was because they actually posed a serious national security threat.

In a manner they represented tangible combat assets for those whom own through support and control, were equivalent to sleeper cells of heavily armed mercenaries, capable of unleashing terror across the US, since they appear up until Turmp admin arrived to operate with impunity.

These cells if ordered could deliver a form of death and chaos from within the borders of the US, in numbers and with mass force at a time like now to further de-stablise the US. This is the kind of playbook we are more use to seeing in the Middle East were terror cells or black-ops mercenaries go on the rampage, like for example the terror reign of ISIS, heavily funded by intel agencies and previous US administration.


#47

The main reveal or take away here is:

The influence of Israel on US policing, training, tactical thinking and it’s deployment against US citizens and diffusion across US policing precincts.

It reveals a level of complexity not exactly catered to in coverage and it’s possible the RUC may have used similar resources in the past, but you might have to dig hard on that one but I could be mixing it up with “school of americas” training.


#48

Candace Owens with some facts that you won’t hear on the completely corrupt mainstream media.


#49

In the US there is very little police training and even less oversight on the forces.
There are about 15,000 different Police Forces in the US. That’s across 50 states. There are probably more. That’s at least 300 differing types per State on average. There are no synergies amongst intra State forces and most virtually compete for influence and power.
The training can take as little as 14 weeks in some States. So in 3.5 months you get a gun, a badge and relative impunity.
They are also very heavily unionised which is no doubt a good thing for the workers but makes any reform impossible. Forces become political footballs for Mayoral and Gubernatorial Candidates. It’s left to States to manage with no central control and is over politized.

And it’s not just about militarization of the police. That exist throughout Europe and South America (ever seen the Austrian or German police in action or the Swiss?). Yet it seems to have a very different effect on the US forces. They seem to blur the lines between the military and the police. The whole premise “to protect and serve” went out the window years ago. Serious reform and standardisation across the federal states is required.

The US does not have a problem with violent protesters. It has a problem with violent police forces.

They are over militarised
Over aggressive
Lack over sight
And overtly racist.


#52

If this is true - ex SF training - Krav Maga stuff - that is out of order.


#53

Induction / recruiting is broken, too many vets coming in, allows easy adoption of military equipment and techniques

Training/cultural issue, effective cultural change is hard.

Agree 1000%, one police force per state is the only solution I can conceive of here.

Could be dealt with if all the above were done.


#54

I don’t think it works if you have both militarized policing and community policing at the same time. It’s one or the other.


#55

Most police forces do both.
They just wear different outfits for each (riot gear versus something more approachable), or do the two approaches in different parts of city/different communities


#56

Induction / recruiting is broken, too many vets coming in, allows easy adoption of military equipment and techniques

I don’t think that’s at the root of the problem.
You also get a lot of people who fancy themselves as soldiers but don’t have the ability or the guts to join the real army. A common criticism is that the police get all this military hardware, but don’t know how to use it.

It’s full of a lot of fakes too. Dave Grossman is often taken as emblematic of the whole warrior cop nonsense. He talks about how cops need to be ready to kill, to have made the decision inside themselves to kill so that they are prepared to do it. That until you kill you’ve never fully unlocked what you can do, etc.,.

And of course he’s actually never killed anyone.





#57

Lots of shrinking violets here it seem. The Irish tendency toward conformist group think reasserts itself it seems. The one post here based on many years of actual street experience with black ghetto thugs gets flagged as inappropriate and blocked because it actually described what these guys are like.

Hands up all those who has had recent interactions with guys just like George Floyd. On their home turf. I think that is just me it seems. If DitchDigger was still around he might admit that some of the people down south in Oakland can be less than friendly. Prunedale, anybody?

Interesting. So a nightclub bouncer who is 6 foot 4, 220 lbs, a long history of violent crime with OD levels of back street lab fenatyl, meth and THC in his blood, severe heart disease dies of a heart attach with barely a scratch on his body and no internal injuries and its somehow police brutality of the most heinous type.

Here is the autopsy

He died of a heart attack with huge amounts of drugs in his system. The only thing the police did was manhandle him to the ground when he resisted arrest. And they called an ambulance once he said he was in distress. What you “saw” in that video like always, is not what actually happened. Just like the Muhammad - al - Durrah incident…

…another of those “Fake But True” stories.

Let me explain to you shrinking violent what the George Floyds of the world do in the real world…

https://patch.com/california/san-francisco/elderly-man-killed-convicted-killer-sentenced

These attacks happen several times a year in San Francisco alone. Usually not fatal. But usually cause serious injuries. Most recent one was old Chinese guy attacked a few months ago. These attacks are pretty common across the country. A dear friend of mine, in his late 70’s, was very lucky not to be very seriously injured in one of these attacks a few years ago.

The perps are always the same, big mo’ fo’ just like Floyd. Long criminal records, big strong guys, usually lots of drugs involved. There are a wide range of characters and types you have to watch out for on the streets. The Floyd type is not that common, you run into them every few months, but they always attack the same way, the sudden random punch. So you watch them very carefully and get out of their range pretty fast.

So does this post breach “community guidelines” too? Saying the media circus around a drugged out street thug who dies of a heart attack with no physical injuries is well, a completely fabricated outrage.

Oh, yeay, this is the guy who gave the eulogy at the funeral…

The biggest racist anti-semitic criminal conman in politics today. Now that is quiet an achievement. If you really hate Jews and and are a Holocaust Denier you’ll just love Sharpton. This guy has a track record of very calculated hate speech that goes back many decades.

And the guy prosecuting the police is State AG Ellsion. Who got his start in politics defending black gang members who murdered police (and others) in cold blood. Lets just say Ellisons close connections with certain gangs over the years seem to be more like PRI/drug cartel connections down in Mexico than any strictly professional legal relationship.

Yes, those are the sort of people who attacking and undermining the police.

So which side are you on? Because I’m with the guys in the PD. Because I know who is on the other side. Stupid clueless people with White Liberal Guilt and a large posse of the unsavory and the outright evil.


#58

We’re talking about 2 approaches to community policing here.

Perhaps as jmc has suggested, the state of the problem has got so bad that community policing in some of these areas is not possible.

(Riot police would be special case and different discussion. )


#59

The population of the US is now over 330million, google tells me that there are over 800K police officers, I don’t for a second believe that all the 800K police are evil racists, but of course I can’t believe they’re all saints, in a country that big bad stuff happens somewhere almost every day, but the strange thing is, why is it usually gentle giants like Floyd or in 2014 Mike Brown that become the cause celebre, it would not be hard to find better quality people to riot about, is the whole thing just a set up to divide people into hostile camps, is it just media manipulation, and all sides are just suckers being played


#60

The BBC says:

Mr Floyd was restrained by officers, while Mr Chauvin placed his left knee between his head and neck.

“I can’t breathe,” Mr Floyd said repeatedly, pleading for his mother and begging “please, please, please”.

For eight minutes and 46 seconds, Mr Chauvin kept his knee on Mr Floyd’s neck, the prosecutors’ report says.

About six minutes into that period, Mr Floyd became non-responsive. In videos of the incident, this was when Mr Floyd fell silent, as bystanders urged the officers to check his pulse.

One of the other officers, JA Kueng, did just that, checking Mr Floyd’s right wrist, but “couldn’t find one”. Yet the other officers did not move.

At 20:27, Mr Chauvin removed his knee from Mr Floyd’s neck. Motionless, Mr Floyd was rolled on to a gurney and taken to the Hennepin County Medical Center in an ambulance.

He was pronounced dead about an hour later.

I get that you’re ok with the extrajudicial killing of Floyd by the police. I don’t get why you feel the need to lie about the circumstances. Or why you need to bellyache about “shrinking violets” just because not everyone agrees with you that the police should be able to execute people on the street, let alone get medals for it. And no, your opinion doesn’t count for more just because you claim to have encountered a few low lifes. The hilarious thing is how you keep banging on about Ireland being a shithole. I actually think you’d fit in better in Duterte’s Philippines. I’m sure he’d welcome an extra enforcer. If you don’t care for the principles of a civilised country you don’t deserve to live in one.


#61

You have to wonder.


#62

It is hard not to think without context that this photo below looks more like a hostage scene set in a bank in a Hollywood movie. One chap looks gagged and bound.

Image

Src: https://twitter.com/GinnyGinny_1/status/1268677007648456704

The symbolic gesture of this “taking a knee” pose, that is enjoying another round of popularity, is clalrye a submissive stance - So what is it all about eh? Submissive to whom eh? :ninja:


#63

Looks like they’re submitting to the gods of finance (the FED) and waiting to make a few more human sacrifices to ensure the future health of the economy!


#64

Dude, did you really just cite BBC as a reliable source of information? :thinking:


#65

The small hats. :gargled:


#66

Citation needed or this is just more anti-Irish racism.

Was this a post by you?

says who

This is shambolic “argument from authority”. You’re asserting random experience that you believe makes you uniquely qualified to comment on the matter at hand. I disagree with your assessment of this, and “reject your authoritay

Here is another autopsy: https://www.nytimes.com/article/george-floyd-autopsy-michael-baden.html
“A private autopsy commissioned by the family concluded that his death was a homicide, brought about by compression of his neck and back by Minneapolis police officers.”
You’ll say it’s motivated in some way. I’ll counter that the first one is definitely motivated.

First of all, he didn’t resist arrest:


When you can’t even get that right it’s hard to know what’s the point of engaging further, but it’s lockdown :kissing_heart:

What do you mean what you see in the video is not what happened? Do you dispute who is in the video? Do you believe it to be CGI or to have been recreated on a soundstage somewhere (maybe the one next door to the moon landings one, that they’re presumeably dusting off for a 21st century return to the moon)?

No, it’s not really comparable.

Before we go further: even if Floyd had health problems that made him more likely to die, that is beside the point when criticising the cop. Kneeling on his neck like that for that length of time poses a significant risk of killing him even if he is fully healthy. Floyd was hand-cuffed, on his front, on the ground and the officer had support around him. The dangerous maneuver was unnecessary, but dangerous, and so the cop is responsible for the consequences.

It’d be like if you went drink driving, and hit a pedestrian at 50 miles an hour. Knocked them down and killed them. No surprise. But there’s a post-mortem, and it turns out, that pedestrian had an aneurysm, it popped as part of the accident! In fact, they were walking home from rugby practice, so it might have been popping already! So sounds like you think you’d be home free…

good luck with that

What is a shrinking violent :rofl: sounds good anyway
See, all of this next stuff is actually irrelevant to the specific case.

I’ll be honest, this sounds like a very personal obsession of yours. Kopfkino that fits closely with a certain media (and by media, I’m going back at least as far as Griffiths and beyond) narrative, that has a certain purchase. Casting the black man (especially) as a brute: large, physically powerful, violent, etc., especially a danger to women, and so on.

Have you actually ever been choked out, to unconsciousness? (I have)

You’re arguing backwards in time now. Does the eulogy at the funeral have a bearing on whether or not the cop’s killing was legitimate? Clue: no.

I’d like to be clear here, are you an admirer? I figure since he’s black, not, but your text indicates a sense of appreciation of what you seem to identify as his craft.

First of all, the legal system in the USA requires that people have legal representation. You cannot simply write-off a lawyer because he did defense work. The latter part is perhaps libelous? In any case, it doesn’t make his arguments false as it’s just another ad hominem attack.

Your arguments here are not a good support of the “side” on which you claim to stand.

Anyway, hugs and kisses babe, :kissing_heart::kissing_heart: