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 Post subject: Re: The Legal Profession- a law onto itself
PostPosted: Wed Nov 28, 2018 4:05 pm 
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Back Home with Mammy

Joined: Oct 11, 2017
Posts: 57
FreeFallin wrote:
I hope the sons don't let this end here and pursue the case as far as it can go. What these people can get away with is astounding

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/c ... 73075.html
Quote:
A solicitor has been found not guilty of professional misconduct after a tribunal dismissed claims there was "no paper trail" for €246,000 in fees charged to a woman she represented in two medical negligence cases.
Five allegations of misconduct against Maura Derivan arising from her actions in relation to the late Ann Waters were rejected by a Solicitors Disciplinary Tribunal yesterday.
The findings came after Ms Derivan produced a copy of a handwritten document signed by Ms Waters, in which she agreed to pay fees of €200,000 plus VAT.
The solicitor, of Derivan Sexton & Co, in Carrick-on-Suir, Co Tipperary, was also cleared of allegations that she deceived Ms Waters's two sons, took advantage of their mother's vulnerability, and seriously delayed the probate of her estate. The case against the solicitor was heard following a complaint by Ms Waters's son William, who represented himself at the tribunal.
Ms Waters received a €2.2m payout in 2012 as settlement of two medical negligence cases in which she was represented by Ms Derivan, who was also the executor of her will.
Ms Waters was in poor health and receiving dialysis at the time of the settlement.
She died in 2014. Her family subsequently learned there was just €800,000 of the settlement monies remaining.
Ms Derivan told the tribunal that after the settlement, Ms Waters asked her to hold the money for her. She said Ms Waters would come to her office and request cheques when she required money.
In the period before her death she received 68 cheques totalling €578,000 from the solicitor. Mr Waters was shocked by this as he believed his mother lived a very frugal lifestyle, only shopping in Aldi and Penneys.
A further €143,000 was paid by way of cheque to four unnamed individuals, at Ms Waters's request. Ms Derivan would not reveal the names of the recipients for reasons of solicitor-client confidentiality....
...Mr Waters said he was unaware of any agreement to pay fees and put it to Ms Derivan she had "scribbled" a solicitor and client agreement "in an effort to deceive the tribunal".

This was strenuously denied by Ms Derivan. The solicitor also denied that she or anyone else had forged Ms Waters's signature on the agreement.

Ms Derivan also said that at no stage did Ms Waters challenge the fee.

She told the tribunal she had no right to ask her client what she was doing with the cheques, which ranged in size from €5,000 to €45,000.

"It was your mother's money. She knew she didn't have a huge life expectancy. She said she was going to spend her money," said Ms Derivan.

In reaching its findings, tribunal chairman Justin Condon accepted Ms Derivan's evidence. He said there was no evidence of deception on her part or that she took advantage of Ms Waters.
So, a solicitor charging 200K plus VAT for professional services. No itemised quote or invoice available? No paper trail? Doesn't seem to be of the standard one would expect of a professional.


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 Post subject: Re: The Legal Profession- a law onto itself
PostPosted: Wed Nov 28, 2018 5:11 pm 
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Old Time Landlord

Joined: Sep 6, 2008
Posts: 398
The sheep have to have audited accounts. Where is the revenue commission in all this and the revenue does make mistakes too. Are a lot of people asleep here, no wonder this country is only half functioning.


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 Post subject: Re: The Legal Profession- a law onto itself
PostPosted: Wed Nov 28, 2018 11:32 pm 
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Neo Landlord

Joined: May 21, 2017
Posts: 204
Seems the heirs, successors and assignees aren't satisfied with their 2 Million Euro windfall. If anyone can win a 2.2 million Euro settlement for me, I'd happily pay them 10% as a finders' fee. 8DD

If there was any justice - no, seriously - if there was any justice, the residue of the settlement would revert to the HSE which is instead consuming limitless amounts of our taxes.


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 Post subject: Re: The Legal Profession- a law onto itself
PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2018 2:37 am 
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Real Estate Developer

Joined: Jan 4, 2010
Posts: 787
Location: Talamh an Éisc
In the Waters matter, why were the sons representing themselves? Did they refuse legal representation? Is it not offered to everyone making a complaint?


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 Post subject: Re: The Legal Profession- a law onto itself
PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2018 11:10 am 
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Of Systemic Importance

Joined: Nov 4, 2011
Posts: 6022
Location: SthDub
Who were the 4 cheques made out to that the Solicitor is refusing to reveal the names of? Can someone independent investigate this to verify it was valid?
We saw in the Judge Perrin case what can happen when things go wrong with money/estates


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 Post subject: Re: The Legal Profession- a law onto itself
PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2018 7:29 pm 
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Planning Tribunal Attendee

Joined: Aug 2, 2011
Posts: 1248
Lefournier3 wrote:
Seems the heirs, successors and assignees aren't satisfied with their 2 Million Euro windfall.


The heirs, successors and assignees aren't satisfied with their...

"She died in 2014. Her family subsequently learned there was just €800,000 of the settlement monies remaining."

..windfall. Quiet rightfully, they would like to have some satisfactory explanation for the disparity.

Quote:
If there was any justice - no, seriously - if there was any justice, the residue of the settlement would revert to the HSE


Why? Are you saying a persons assets ought to be consumed for their care? IOW dump the welfare state? Surely if you pay into it you ought be able extract from it.


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 Post subject: Re: The Legal Profession- a law onto itself
PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2018 9:00 pm 
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Property Magnate

Joined: Jan 7, 2008
Posts: 643
york wrote:
Why? Are you saying a persons assets ought to be consumed for their care? IOW dump the welfare state? Surely if you pay into it you ought be able extract from it.


I think he means that a payout awarded from medical malpractice calculated on the basis of a normal life expectancy shouldn't just be handed to your relatives if you die, which is perfectly reasonable. Periodic payment orders are now on the way instead.


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 Post subject: Re: The Legal Profession- a law onto itself
PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2018 9:16 pm 
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Of Systemic Importance

Joined: Nov 4, 2011
Posts: 6022
Location: SthDub
tinneym wrote:
york wrote:
Why? Are you saying a persons assets ought to be consumed for their care? IOW dump the welfare state? Surely if you pay into it you ought be able extract from it.


I think he means that a payout awarded from medical malpractice calculated on the basis of a normal life expectancy shouldn't just be handed to your relatives if you die, which is perfectly reasonable. Periodic payment orders are now on the way instead.

The legal racket won't like that


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 Post subject: Re: The Legal Profession- a law onto itself
PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2018 12:24 pm 
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Of Systemic Importance

Joined: Sep 13, 2012
Posts: 5399
FreeFallin wrote:
tinneym wrote:
york wrote:
Why? Are you saying a persons assets ought to be consumed for their care? IOW dump the welfare state? Surely if you pay into it you ought be able extract from it.


I think he means that a payout awarded from medical malpractice calculated on the basis of a normal life expectancy shouldn't just be handed to your relatives if you die, which is perfectly reasonable. Periodic payment orders are now on the way instead.

The legal racket won't like that

As far as I know it's the solicitors making the big bucks from percentages on individual PI cases, as the barristers get paid something a bit like day rates.

There really isn't a "legal profession" in this country, the two professions are regulated and organised separately although there are occasional migrants from one side of the fence to another.

_________________
"It's easy to confuse what is with what ought to be, especially when what is has worked out in your favour"
Tyrion Lannister


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