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 Post subject: Re: National Broadband Plan will cost the taxpayer over €2bn
PostPosted: Sun Dec 02, 2018 7:49 pm 
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Skippy 3 wrote:
Why don't people who really value broadband not just move house?

People who really value broadband do not live in houses without it.

However, that is not necessarily a good argument for keeping those houses broadband-free.

If you put high speed connections in them they will become attractive to those who value high speed connections. That may include the relatively small fraction of the workforce able to work from home, who may appreciate escaping their urban rabbit hutches, freeing up that accomodation for those that truly need it, and injecting a bit of youth into rural Ireland.

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 Post subject: Re: National Broadband Plan will cost the taxpayer over €2bn
PostPosted: Sun Dec 02, 2018 9:26 pm 
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A full 4% of the Irish workforce work from home.

Many of these don't need a broadband connection.

I would generously estimate that 1% of the workforce would work from home if broadband was better.

This won't tip the cost-benefit scales very much.


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 Post subject: Re: National Broadband Plan will cost the taxpayer over €2bn
PostPosted: Mon Dec 03, 2018 12:38 am 
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If you built a gaff down a Boreen with no 3G/4G access or broadband in the last 10 to 15 years then why should they get broadband now?

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 Post subject: Re: National Broadband Plan will cost the taxpayer over €2bn
PostPosted: Mon Dec 03, 2018 7:19 pm 
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tulip wrote:
If you built a gaff down a Boreen with no 3G/4G access or broadband in the last 10 to 15 years then why should they get broadband now?


They have neither for the same reason, the operators don't care, and efforts are underway to improve both mobile and fixed line networks in Ireland.

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 Post subject: Re: National Broadband Plan will cost the taxpayer over €2bn
PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2018 1:16 pm 
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Is it really reasonable to expect to cover every depression and radio shadow and put a fibre down every road even though someone built a gaff down there knowing full well that there was no decent broadband.

And only half-jokingly what about team Tinfoil that don't want radio coverage and picked their spot specifically not to have it.

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 Post subject: Re: National Broadband Plan will cost the taxpayer over €2bn
PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2018 10:53 pm 
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tulip wrote:
Is it really reasonable to expect to cover every depression and radio shadow and put a fibre down every road even though someone built a gaff down there knowing full well that there was no decent broadband.

Yes, you said that already. If you can put a phone line down there, you can string fibre. the process is no different, apart from a node splitter, no extra equipment is required. To provide anything else, you need to get fibre to the cabinet (whether that's mobile or FTTC, fibre has to get to it), so we're really only talking about the last few miles.

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 Post subject: Re: National Broadband Plan will cost the taxpayer over €2bn
PostPosted: Tue Dec 11, 2018 9:33 am 
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Here's an interesting aside on the limitations of Satellite broadband and possibly on Musk's actual target audience...
https://www.theregister.co.uk/2018/12/1 ... n_network/
Quote:
The tribunal also said that, from the evidence it heard, the EAN satellite’s “maximum capacity is 42.1Mbits/s or 19 Gbytes/hr and the ground cells’ aggregate capacity was 34,268 Mbits/s or 15,421Gbytes/hr.”

It added, after hearing figures from experts: “What we can say is that those figures demonstrate that the satellite by itself can service no more (and probably less) than 2 aircraft on the high load scenario, and something like 20 aircraft on the low load scenario.” The high load scenario was expressed as 50 per cent of passengers aboard an airliner “streaming, browsing and using social media”. The low load scenario's details were redacted from the judgment because it revealed commercially sensitive information.

Given the design intent of the EAN, the airliners under discussion are likely to be Boeing 737 or Airbus A320-type airliners capable of carrying around 180 people at a time. No specifics were given in the judgment, though it noted that “there are on average 550 shorthaul planes flying above Europe at any one time”.

Nonetheless, only around eight per cent of European flights (“44 aircraft”), according to the evidence shown to the tribunal, are expected to need the satellite instead of the ground stations. The CAT said: “If only half of those were fitted with EAN then the low load scenario would be capable of being fulfilled in respect of practically all those planes,” while adding that these projections may not “necessarily reflect the real world operation of the system.”


Not so much the specifics of EAN, but how much capacity is expected to be required for satellite only broadband, e.g. in places that don't have ground stations (most of the world).

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 Post subject: Re: National Broadband Plan will cost the taxpayer over €2bn
PostPosted: Tue Dec 11, 2018 1:59 pm 
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yoganmahew wrote:
tulip wrote:
Is it really reasonable to expect to cover every depression and radio shadow and put a fibre down every road even though someone built a gaff down there knowing full well that there was no decent broadband.

Yes, you said that already. If you can put a phone line down there, you can string fibre. the process is no different, apart from a node splitter, no extra equipment is required. To provide anything else, you need to get fibre to the cabinet (whether that's mobile or FTTC, fibre has to get to it), so we're really only talking about the last few miles.


True, I did repeat myself :oops:

I'm not an expert on landline installation but I was talking to an ex-Eir emloyee and he says hooking up a one off can be expensive if new poles have to be laid. Now most of that work is already done for most houses so they don't have that cost but for FTTC you still have to back haul all those cabinets and exchanges to handle the increased traffic which is a job of itself.

Fibre to the gaff to me is like rolling out the copper network again (without having to plant poles). If it was easy SIRO would've done it.

BTW it's not just rural areas that have gack broadband. I live inside the M50 and get between 2-5Mbps as my cabinet hasn't been hooked up to fibre even though all the surrounding ones have. Luckily SIRO is coming to my area so I'll be gigabitting it soon :D

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 Post subject: Re: National Broadband Plan will cost the taxpayer over €2bn
PostPosted: Tue Dec 11, 2018 7:22 pm 
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tulip wrote:
BTW it's not just rural areas that have gack broadband. I live inside the M50 and get between 2-5Mbps as my cabinet hasn't been hooked up to fibre even though all the surrounding ones have. Luckily SIRO is coming to my area so I'll be gigabitting it soon :D

Absolutely - I lived in an apartment block in Dublin at one stage, and there was zero permission for private lines, but the copper in to the apartments was disastrous even for dial-up. Refitting them to have decent phone and fiber or cat6 is a large ugly job (since they're plastered into the walls). Many older houses have manky internal wiring too!

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 Post subject: Re: National Broadband Plan will cost the taxpayer over €2bn
PostPosted: Wed Dec 12, 2018 9:37 am 
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It could be worse, though, we could be like the US and have a regulator that's in the telcos' pockets, with a definition of broadband that's heading back to 4/1...
https://www.theregister.co.uk/2018/12/1 ... _internet/

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