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 Post subject: Re: Irish Gov Social Housing Policy 5th Nov 2018 - In a Twe
PostPosted: Wed Nov 07, 2018 11:05 am 
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Single Home Owner

Joined: Oct 29, 2014
Posts: 119
temene wrote:
Plenty of voters are finally making the connection between
unrestricted immigration
and
housing, school places, hospital lists, GP closed lists, traffic congestion, public transport full to brim, gig economy jobs...


+ You had net 20K non eu migration in the last year
+ 120K given citizenship over the last few years
+ An amnesty scheme then for illegal migrants

Previously it was shown that half on fingal waiting list weren't even Irish citizens(but still qualify for housing).
https://www.herald.ie/news/over-half-on ... 73856.html

Eoghan Murphy can never solve a housing crisis under these conditions. Being a sociopath like most politicians hes not too bothered I imagine.

The photo itself is amazing and shows how fucked ireland is.

The photo opportunist politicians totally oblivious to the bad optics.

The "new Irish"(who hold sudanese passports or whatever) who certainly aren't moving in besides Pat Kenny aren't even cracking a smile - maybe they were promised stables and didnt get them?

Only a month ago varadkar was saying "that immigrants were “more likely to be working than the average Irish person and more likely to be paying tax”. I wonder what the life time tax bill for this lot will be? Millions?

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 Post subject: Re: Irish Gov Social Housing Policy 5th Nov 2018 - In a Twe
PostPosted: Fri Nov 09, 2018 12:00 pm 
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Old Time Landlord

Joined: Feb 9, 2009
Posts: 369
There's a massive amount of resentment at the disproportionate numbers of "new Irish" allocated social housing, and it's been building for some years. We've been fed this propaganda that migrants are self-supporting and harder-working than Irish people but it's clearly not the case when you factor in social housing, the RAS scheme, education, healthcare, social services etc. Many Irish people do not see the point in so many people coming to live here that are economically unproductive and culturally very different - it certainly brings nothing of use to them. I think it's very worrying, the huge disconnect between the official line that's trotted out by politicians and media, and what people can see with their own eyes. It's going to lead to real social unrest as it has all over Europe.


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 Post subject: Re: Irish Gov Social Housing Policy 5th Nov 2018 - In a Twe
PostPosted: Fri Nov 09, 2018 12:08 pm 
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Too Big to Fail

Joined: Aug 8, 2008
Posts: 3637
Location: Cathair na dTreabh
Posted this before, but this Cllr will top the poll
Further there is zero transparency or accountability in local authority housing departments
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 Post subject: Re: Irish Gov Social Housing Policy 5th Nov 2018 - In a Twe
PostPosted: Fri Nov 09, 2018 12:33 pm 
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Back Home with Mammy

Joined: Oct 11, 2017
Posts: 58
paracetomol wrote:
There's a massive amount of resentment at the disproportionate numbers of "new Irish" allocated social housing, and it's been building for some years. We've been fed this propaganda that migrants are self-supporting and harder-working than Irish people but it's clearly not the case when you factor in social housing, the RAS scheme, education, healthcare, social services etc. Many Irish people do not see the point in so many people coming to live here that are economically unproductive and culturally very different - it certainly brings nothing of use to them. I think it's very worrying, the huge disconnect between the official line that's trotted out by politicians and media, and what people can see with their own eyes. It's going to lead to real social unrest as it has all over Europe.
Some people coming here already own property in their own country.

And others here on housing assistance manage to save up to subsequently buy a property in their country of origin, while retaining their subsidised housing here.


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 Post subject: Re: Irish Gov Social Housing Policy 5th Nov 2018 - In a Twe
PostPosted: Fri Nov 09, 2018 12:49 pm 
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Old Time Landlord

Joined: Feb 9, 2009
Posts: 369
Yes, it's very open to abuse and difficult to monitor. I've heard countless stories I won't bother to repeat here because I'll get the usual "the plural of anecdote is not data" kind of responses, or be called a racist, but suffice to say it's disruptive to the basic social contract we enter into when we pay tax and support those who need it.


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 Post subject: Re: Irish Gov Social Housing Policy 5th Nov 2018 - In a Twe
PostPosted: Fri Nov 09, 2018 12:52 pm 
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Too Big to Fail
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Posts: 4533
Location: Mesopotatia
No anecdotes? The forum could implode without an auld anecdote here and there. Here's one to please the anecdote gods.

I do know such a person. Already has a house back home. They take days off* in lieu of overtime in their employment so that they aren't paid too much such that it'd affect their benefits. His Irish wife doesn't work and they're on a housing waiting list too.

* To clarify. This isn't paid leave. It's unpaid days off.

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 Post subject: Re: Irish Gov Social Housing Policy 5th Nov 2018 - In a Twe
PostPosted: Fri Nov 09, 2018 2:22 pm 
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Holiday Home Owner

Joined: Jun 28, 2010
Posts: 331
ok- quick devil's advocate here- three cases to compare:

Polish guy early 30s, in the country 9 years- living in homeless accommodation due to divorce and his subsequent landlord then selling the property he had rented a room in. Has a child and therefore is on the 2 bed waiting list. Has worked all the time he is here in a 24 hour rostered role. often has to mind his child in the daytime after working the night shift and goes into work again that evening with only 2 hours sleep under his belt on those days.

Algerian man. Divorced. three kids live with the ex. living in homeless accommodation as he was self employed/casual worker in the catering industry and couldn't make his rent payments on his one bed flat when work got a bit scarce. Goes out to work 4/5 nights a week and returns to homeless accommodation at 3;30 am on those nights, he has to share a room with an active, chaotic drug user.


Irish man. mid twenties. has three kids and separated from partner. has never had a proper job or fully supported his kids and has another girl pregnant. Refuses to engage with education or training options. Is on the two bed list but only sees his kids as and when he feels like it. supplements his €100 social welfare payment acting as a runner for a medium scale drug dealer. Is never out of bed before lunch time.

Who do you think deserves priority housing out of the three homeless people above? Should nationality/ethnicity come into it? Local authority officials are not fools.

For all we know that family in the photo have done their time on the waiting list like any other applicant


For the record the optics of the photo are bad but the twitter comments are bile inducing.


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 Post subject: Re: Irish Gov Social Housing Policy 5th Nov 2018 - In a Twe
PostPosted: Fri Nov 09, 2018 3:41 pm 
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Of Systemic Importance

Joined: May 18, 2007
Posts: 6336
Location: On the Road
How long before people begin to associate attempted actions such as the following with twitter pictures such as that in the OP.....

Quote:

Knocklyon FC Chairman says club could fold if 42 social houses built on land

The head of Knocklyon United says the Dublin club could fold if plans for 42 social housing homes go ahead.


The pitches at Ballycullen Park are leased to the club but South Dublin County Council is to take the land back to build homes.

The football club's Chairman Donal Skelly says they have 600 kids with the new girls-only teams the fastest growing group.

Mr Skelly claims the development puts that at risk.


"The Council wants to build 42 houses on (our) pitch, plus around the corner of our site leading up to the road which is about 70% of the land (at Ballycullen Park)," he said.

"If we lose this pitch it's absolutely devastating to the club."
"We need to be able to maintain this. As a club, we have nothing against social housing, we see the need for it, but this is not the right location," he said.

Digital Desk

Knocklyon UnitedBallycullen ParkHousingSocial Housing


https://www.google.co.in/amp/s/amp.iris ... 58683.html

I suppose the answer to the questions in and around these issues lies in examining who it is exactly that benefits most from current policy .....and why.....

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 Post subject: Re: Irish Gov Social Housing Policy 5th Nov 2018 - In a Twe
PostPosted: Fri Nov 09, 2018 6:13 pm 
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Joined: Jan 1, 1970
Posts: 23262
paracetomol wrote:
Yes, it's very open to abuse and difficult to monitor. I've heard countless stories I won't bother to repeat here because I'll get the usual "the plural of anecdote is not data" kind of responses, or be called a racist, but suffice to say it's disruptive to the basic social contract we enter into when we pay tax and support those who need it.


Which comes first, Data or Life?

What are we but mere witnesses to our own life, carry on and post what anecdotes you have encountered for the sake of the whole.

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 Post subject: Re: Irish Gov Social Housing Policy 5th Nov 2018 - In a Twe
PostPosted: Fri Nov 09, 2018 6:21 pm 
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Old Time Landlord

Joined: Feb 9, 2009
Posts: 369
tommyt wrote:
ok- quick devil's advocate here- three cases to compare:

Polish guy early 30s, in the country 9 years- living in homeless accommodation due to divorce and his subsequent landlord then selling the property he had rented a room in. Has a child and therefore is on the 2 bed waiting list. Has worked all the time he is here in a 24 hour rostered role. often has to mind his child in the daytime after working the night shift and goes into work again that evening with only 2 hours sleep under his belt on those days.

Algerian man. Divorced. three kids live with the ex. living in homeless accommodation as he was self employed/casual worker in the catering industry and couldn't make his rent payments on his one bed flat when work got a bit scarce. Goes out to work 4/5 nights a week and returns to homeless accommodation at 3;30 am on those nights, he has to share a room with an active, chaotic drug user.


Irish man. mid twenties. has three kids and separated from partner. has never had a proper job or fully supported his kids and has another girl pregnant. Refuses to engage with education or training options. Is on the two bed list but only sees his kids as and when he feels like it. supplements his €100 social welfare payment acting as a runner for a medium scale drug dealer. Is never out of bed before lunch time.

Who do you think deserves priority housing out of the three homeless people above? Should nationality/ethnicity come into it? Local authority officials are not fools.

For all we know that family in the photo have done their time on the waiting list like any other applicant


For the record the optics of the photo are bad but the twitter comments are bile inducing.


I agree the Twitter comments are horrible. But in relation to your point: housing policy used to measure your eligibility for public housing partly by your connections to the neighbourhood and general area. This was sidelined in the 70s in favour of "need", prioritising those with the most children, risk of homelessness, disability etc - and the fallout from this was that it provided perverse incentives to get to the top of the list. When you extend this policy to the people of the entire world, it starts to be a real problem. Newly arrived immigrants are more likely to be able to declare themselves homeless,some groups have large families, all the criteria for getting to the top of the list. And this creates resentment in the local population, and anger that historic resources in the form of tax take, are being spent on outsiders. I know you talk about a Polish person or Algerian person on the housing list for nine years and having "served their time" but this is meaningless to a lot of Irish people, and just looks like gaming the system. None of us would get the slightest help with accommodation if we were to move to Poland or Algeria, where wages are much lower. The traffic is only going in one direction and there's been no slowdown at all, quite the opposite.


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