Board index » The IRISH PROPERTY BUBBLE » The Golden Circle » NAMAwatch (Pt. I)

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 Post subject: Re: Judge Kelly: dead developer's tiny estate "extraordinary
PostPosted: Wed Jul 28, 2010 8:32 am 
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Larry wrote:
When I want to get bollock-to-bollock intimate with a sweating cuchie while drinking warm beer to a soundtrack of deafeningly loud music, Flanney's is my first stop. €15m? Farking priceless mate.


Nice. The song is usually Bryan Adam's Summer of 69. There isnt a culchie alive that doesnt get up for that one.

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 Post subject: Re: Judge Kelly: dead developer's tiny estate "extraordinary
PostPosted: Wed Jul 28, 2010 9:20 am 
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invite libel or defamation actions
I thought you couldn't slander/libel a dead man ?

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 Post subject: Re: Judge Kelly: dead developer's tiny estate "extraordinary
PostPosted: Wed Jul 28, 2010 9:24 am 
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Rick Flair wrote:
Larry wrote:
When I want to get bollock-to-bollock intimate with a sweating cuchie while drinking warm beer to a soundtrack of deafeningly loud music, Flanney's is my first stop. €15m? Farking priceless mate.


Nice. The song is usually Bryan Adam's Summer of 69. There isnt a culchie alive that doesnt get up for that one.




That's coz we culchies have soul.


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 Post subject: Re: Judge Kelly: dead developer's tiny estate "extraordinary
PostPosted: Wed Jul 28, 2010 12:15 pm 
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Duisigh wrote:
Quote:
invite libel or defamation actions
I thought you couldn't slander/libel a dead man ?


Perfectly correct !

But then the dead are rarely interested in evading taxes & debts.

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"Mr Kelly said Ireland’s “reputational capital” had been damaged by “chancers” such as ex-Anglo Irish Bank chairman Seán FitzPatrick, who had been abetted by “buffoons” such as former financial regulator Patrick Neary, Minister for Finance Brian Lenihan and the Taoiseach." - Irish Times 13th Jan 2009

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 Post subject: Re: Judge Kelly: dead developer's tiny estate "extraordinary
PostPosted: Wed Jul 28, 2010 3:12 pm 
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Damian Keaney, for AIB, said the bank had not wished to adopt a “sledgehammer” approach immediately after Mr Maye’s death and it was legally entitled to issue proceedings up to two years after death.


You could buy a lot of sledgehammers for €58 million you fucking tulips.

But well done AIB for handling this delicate matter so sensitively

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 Post subject: Re: Judge Kelly: dead developer's tiny estate "extraordinary
PostPosted: Wed Jul 28, 2010 11:30 pm 
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In general the greater part of work is done before papers are lodged in the Seat Office. Once the papers are in order and the Revenue Affidavit sworn and returned a Grant of Probate will issue quite quickly. Nothing unusual about a Grant being given within the timeframe mentioned here.

Where the fortune this man apparently had has gone, is quite another question. He could of course have transferred the greater part of hs assets to his spouse -in which case they would not form part of his estate.

Since there is no CAT liability on any amount of wealth transferred to a spouse he could have happily done so -delaying any CAT on family assets -should he have children. The Revenue Affidavit will probably disclose this. Peter Kelly's metaphorically raised eyebrow is understandable -but he may not have had sight of the Affidavit -only a copy of the Grant and it does not mean that there is necessarily anything amiss


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 Post subject: Re: Judge Kelly: dead developer's tiny estate "extraordinary
PostPosted: Wed Jul 28, 2010 11:58 pm 
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Does a transfer before death (within a certain timeframe) not count as an inheritance when the person actually dies? I know this is the case in the UK, but is it here?

So, for example, if I was dying of cancer, could I get a loan of 10 million, give a million to each of my family and my friend and then just say "screw you, urgh" and die to the bank?

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 Post subject: Re: Judge Kelly: dead developer's tiny estate "extraordinary
PostPosted: Thu Jul 29, 2010 12:34 am 
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Any transfers which may be construed as an attempt to avoid just debts would probably be overturned. Many of the spate of transfers to spouses in the past year or two are certainly open to successful challenge.

Liabilities in the general sense will remain as debts to be satisfied out of the dead person's estate. Generally the separate corporate existence of companies would have given many developers limited liability but of course as we know in the dying days of the mad economy many of them gave personal guarantees.

Whatever wealth which this man may have legitimately acquired may well have been transferred and may not have been subject to any charges or guarantees. Estate planning has become quite an art and like 'limiting' one's tax liability as distinct from 'tax avoidance' is perfectly legal.

There is a three year provsion with respect to the disposal of assets before death but my understanding of this part of the 65 Act is that it is activated where a spouse or children may have had their expectaions disappointed rather than 'strangers' or other parties.


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 Post subject: Re: Judge Kelly: dead developer's tiny estate "extraordinary
PostPosted: Thu Jul 29, 2010 7:35 pm 
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AIB were led to believe that Maye was 'worth' €100m, by which professionals I ask ???

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 Post subject: Re: Judge Kelly: dead developer's tiny estate "extraordinary
PostPosted: Thu Jul 29, 2010 9:35 pm 
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laughinglawyer wrote:
Any transfers which may be construed as an attempt to avoid just debts would probably be overturned. Many of the spate of transfers to spouses in the past year or two are certainly open to successful challenge.

Liabilities in the general sense will remain as debts to be satisfied out of the dead person's estate. Generally the separate corporate existence of companies would have given many developers limited liability but of course as we know in the dying days of the mad economy many of them gave personal guarantees.

Whatever wealth which this man may have legitimately acquired may well have been transferred and may not have been subject to any charges or guarantees. Estate planning has become quite an art and like 'limiting' one's tax liability as distinct from 'tax avoidance' is perfectly legal.

There is a three year provsion with respect to the disposal of assets before death but my understanding of this part of the 65 Act is that it is activated where a spouse or children may have had their expectaions disappointed rather than 'strangers' or other parties.


I really hope you are right,
but i'll believe it when I see it.

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