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 Post subject: Re: A Post 8th Amendment world.
PostPosted: Thu Aug 30, 2018 10:43 pm 
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What would happen if the next President refused to sign abortion legalization into law?

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 Post subject: Re: A Post 8th Amendment world.
PostPosted: Fri Aug 31, 2018 8:20 am 
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Mossy_Heneberry wrote:
What would happen if the next President refused to sign abortion legalization into law?

Ah Mossy, we had these discussions before on the bailout bill. That's not how the presidency works. The President can refer a bill to the supreme court for consitutionality check, but that's it.

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 Post subject: Re: A Post 8th Amendment world.
PostPosted: Fri Aug 31, 2018 1:49 pm 
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yoganmahew wrote:
Mossy_Heneberry wrote:
What would happen if the next President refused to sign abortion legalization into law?

Ah Mossy, we had these discussions before on the bailout bill. That's not how the presidency works. The President can refer a bill to the supreme court for consitutionality check, but that's it.


More accurately: The president cannot legally refuse to sign a bill. If they just physically refused to sign a bill, like "You can't make me, nah nah nah nah" (and it could be any bill, doesn't matter at all which) it would be a gross violation of the constitution and should lead to the Oireachtas removing him or her for "stated misbehaviour".

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 Post subject: Re: A Post 8th Amendment world.
PostPosted: Fri Aug 31, 2018 3:59 pm 
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Mantissa wrote:
yoganmahew wrote:
Mossy_Heneberry wrote:
What would happen if the next President refused to sign abortion legalization into law?

Ah Mossy, we had these discussions before on the bailout bill. That's not how the presidency works. The President can refer a bill to the supreme court for consitutionality check, but that's it.


More accurately: The president cannot legally refuse to sign a bill. If they just physically refused to sign a bill, like "You can't make me, nah nah nah nah" (and it could be any bill, doesn't matter at all which) it would be a gross violation of the constitution and should lead to the Oireachtas removing him or her for "stated misbehaviour".

As well as being totally undemocratic.

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 Post subject: Re: A Post 8th Amendment world.
PostPosted: Thu Nov 15, 2018 3:38 pm 
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I'll pop this here and let it sink in.

Quote:
Minister for Health Simon Harris has said he wants to make sure women from Northern Ireland can access abortion services in the Republic.

Mr Harris is meeting representatives of organisations from Northern Ireland who are in favour of abortion.

He said women in Northern Ireland can already access healthcare in Ireland across a range of areas and it is "appropriate and important" that they can access abortion services rather than travel by train or boat to Britain.

Mr Harris said he is working to pass legislation by the Dáil Christmas break with a view to services commencing in January.

He said it is "a matter of great regret" that women on the whole island of Ireland cannot access healthcare in relation to crisis pregnancy situations.

https://www.rte.ie/news/ireland/2018/11 ... -abortion/

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 Post subject: Re: A Post 8th Amendment world.
PostPosted: Thu Nov 15, 2018 10:49 pm 
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Fek me, I never knew FG were a United Ireland party. When did that happen!
And hasn't Harris come a long way in 2 or so years...he used to be anti-abortion. He's a raving pro abortion fundamentalist at this stage.

Who's paying for this by the way?


Last edited by FreeFallin on Fri Nov 16, 2018 11:58 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: A Post 8th Amendment world.
PostPosted: Thu Nov 15, 2018 11:28 pm 
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FreeFallin wrote:
Fek me, I never knew FG were a United Ireland party. When did that happen!


I never knew they were a lot of things, the next election will be interesting

FreeFallin wrote:
Who's paying for his by the way?


His or this ?

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 Post subject: Re: A Post 8th Amendment world.
PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2018 11:22 am 
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FreeFallin wrote:
Fek me, I never knew FG were a United Ireland party. When did that happen!
And hasn't Harris come a long way in 2 or so years...he used to be anti-abortion. He's a raving pro abortion fundamentalist at this stage.

Who's paying for his by the way?


who is paying?

https://twitter.com/DrCollins10/status/ ... 9813625857

those who enjoy broadsheet can get the same story here
https://www.broadsheet.ie/2018/05/02/to ... h-service/

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 Post subject: Re: A Post 8th Amendment world.
PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2018 11:57 am 
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Quote:
https://twitter.com/ldnirisharc/status/1000412799611408385
@LdnIrishARC

You betcha! Our campaign doesn’t stop here. Thinking of all the women travelling from Northern Ireland for abortion care today. We won’t stop until we have safe and legal abortion access for women across the island of Ireland. #together4yes
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 Post subject: Re: A Post 8th Amendment world.
PostPosted: Sat Nov 17, 2018 11:01 pm 
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Open Window wrote:
Image


That's the kind of photo that can be used if any misfortune happens to SF, like a party split or major loss of seats in the Dail.


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 Post subject: Re: A Post 8th Amendment world.
PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2018 2:00 am 
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A bit O/T but didn't want to start yet another "culture of death" thread.

Three Belgian doctors are to be tried for killing a 38 year old mildly autistic (but otherwise healthy) woman. They approved her for euthanasia in 2010, but her family subsequently complained.

https://www.nytimes.com/aponline/2018/1 ... nasia.html

Voluntary euthanasia has been legal in Belgium since 2002, and for children since 2013. There were 80 cases in the first year, rising steadily to about 2,000 a year now, or 1.7% of all deaths. Initially those euthanised were terminally ill cancer patients (and two thirds still are), but a growing number of non-terminally ill people including older people in care are being killed. One sixth are people not expected to die in the foreseeable future.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5088089/

About 3% of euthanasia cases are for psychiatric disorders, from mood disorders to dementia. The majority of people euthanised for these reasons are women.

https://bmcpsychiatry.biomedcentral.com ... 017-1369-0

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 Post subject: Re: A Post 8th Amendment world.
PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2018 11:59 am 
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ps200306 wrote:
A bit O/T but didn't want to start yet another "culture of death" thread.

Three Belgian doctors are to be tried for killing a 38 year old mildly autistic (but otherwise healthy) woman. They approved her for euthanasia in 2010, but her family subsequently complained.

https://www.nytimes.com/aponline/2018/1 ... nasia.html

Voluntary euthanasia has been legal in Belgium since 2002, and for children since 2013. There were 80 cases in the first year, rising steadily to about 2,000 a year now, or 1.7% of all deaths. Initially those euthanised were terminally ill cancer patients (and two thirds still are), but a growing number of non-terminally ill people including older people in care are being killed. One sixth are people not expected to die in the foreseeable future.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5088089/

About 3% of euthanasia cases are for psychiatric disorders, from mood disorders to dementia. The majority of people euthanised for these reasons are women.

https://bmcpsychiatry.biomedcentral.com ... 017-1369-0

That is an interesting post but it should have its own thread.

Conflating these two issues is misleading at best and it deliberately seeks to link abortion with euthanasia which is wrong.

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 Post subject: Re: A Post 8th Amendment world.
PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2018 12:25 pm 
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Terra Incognita wrote:
That is an interesting post but it should have its own thread.

Conflating these two issues is misleading at best and it deliberately seeks to link abortion with euthanasia which is wrong.

Sure, it's all the same issue. Killing babies, killing disabled people, killing unwanted daughters in third world countries, dispatching inconvenient lives, selfishness of modern society, slippery slope to Logan's Run, Nazi death camps, Stalin was an atheist etc etc.

Only God can give life and only God should take it away.

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 Post subject: Re: A Post 8th Amendment world.
PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2018 7:23 am 
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Eschatologist wrote:
Sure, it's all the same issue. .......killing unwanted daughters in third world countries, .......


Funny you mention that....unless you're of the view that the UK is 'third world' (although I think 'developing world' is the preferred term nowadays).

Quote:
Blood tests used to reveal a baby’s gender are leading to the abortion of unwanted girls in the UK, MPs and charities have warned.

Labour MP Naz Shah, shadow women and equalities minister, said the government must act now to stop the misuse of Non-Invasive Prenatal Test (NIPT) to abort pregnancies based on gender.

The NHS only allows pregnant women the early blood test to screen for genetic conditions, but private clinics are offering expectant parents the chance to find out their baby’s gender for around £150 to £200.

“The government needs to look into this exploitative practice and enforce appropriate restrictions," Ms Shah told the BBC’s Victoria Derbyshire programme.

The MP said a cultural preference for boys among some ethnic minority communities in the UK was “forcing (women) to adopt methods such as NIPT to live up to expectations of family members”.

An investigation by the programme found “thousands” of pregnant women using online forums to discuss the discovery of their baby’s gender through NIPT testing.

Jeena International, a charity supporting women from ethnic minority communities in the UK, said some women were forced into abortions because they became pregnant with a girl for a second or third time.

“No wonder they’re resorting to sex-selection abortion because they’ve got no choice,” said the charity’s founder Rani Bilkhu. “They don’t want to be homeless, they don’t want their marriage to fail – all because they couldn’t give birth to a boy.”

Both India and China have brought laws banning sex-selective abortions.

The Nuffield Council on Bioethics, a government advisory body, has warned that increasingly widespread private NIPT testing in the UK could lead to the country becoming a haven for “sex-selective” abortions.

Dr Tom Shakespeare said: “The desire for sex-selection is a major driver of private-sector testing. I don’t think the government want to regulate, they just don’t like it in any sector.

“But countries like China and India have recognised the problem of sex-selective abortion… So if we allow it, people will come here as tourists.”


Tan Dhesi, Labour MP for Slough, said private clinics should not be allowed to advertise NIPT tests for gender determination.

A spokesman for the Department of Health and Social Care said the government would “continue to review the evidence” on NIPT testing in the UK.



https://www.independent.co.uk/news/heal ... 40851.html

The bolded section in particular seems particularly relevant given that the suggestion that it could happen in Ireland was branded a conspiracy theory by some during the course of the referendum thread.

Maybe some people who oppose this stuff are actually genuine in their belief that its an affront to the defence of human rights generally?

And maybe some who decry anything they dislike as a conspiracy are simply agreeable fuckwits?

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 Post subject: Re: A Post 8th Amendment world.
PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2018 7:53 am 
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the dude wrote:
FreeFallin wrote:
Fek me, I never knew FG were a United Ireland party. When did that happen!


I never knew they were a lot of things, the next election will be interesting

FreeFallin wrote:
Who's paying for his by the way?


His or this ?


It would probably play into Harris' hands if the Pro Life crowd decided to single him out for negative campaign due to his baby holocaust role. He'd love to distract attention from what his actual day job is. He's clinging to abortion as a good news story because the health service is so terrible. He was on the news the other night saying 'I just want to be open and prepare people for how bad the winter will be in hospitals'. He just doesn't get that as a nation we hate being "managed". Eoghan Murphy doesn't get this either btw.

I think Harris is just poor. Tony O'Brien's criticism of him was severe and is one of numerous things that have permanently damaged him. He's been made look ridiculous and out of his depth. He'll keep his seat because he has profile but he'll be Tourism minister after the next reshuffle and out of the cabinet in the one after that. I don't know if there's an astronomical term for a young developing star gradually changing to one that's declining and disappearing, but that's what we're witnessing. Unless Leo takes pity on him.


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