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 Post subject: Re: SpaceX - The Quest For Mars
PostPosted: Wed Jul 18, 2018 10:14 pm 
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Another couple of decades and we'll probably be designing humans for these kinds of situations and worries about radiation and low gravity will be moot, or the Chinese will anyway.


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 Post subject: Re: SpaceX - The Quest For Mars
PostPosted: Wed Jul 18, 2018 10:27 pm 
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Thargor wrote:
Another couple of decades and we'll probably be designing humans for these kinds of situations and worries about radiation and low gravity will be moot, or the Chinese will anyway.

Why don't we just design robots to do it. They can establish the "colony" and keep it running. It'd be like keeping the larder stocked in the nuclear bunker. Just 'cos you want to have it for backup doesn't mean you want to live there all the time.

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 Post subject: Re: SpaceX - The Quest For Mars
PostPosted: Thu Jul 19, 2018 9:57 am 
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ps200306 wrote:
Thargor wrote:
Another couple of decades and we'll probably be designing humans for these kinds of situations and worries about radiation and low gravity will be moot, or the Chinese will anyway.

Why don't we just design robots to do it. They can establish the "colony" and keep it running. It'd be like keeping the larder stocked in the nuclear bunker. Just 'cos you want to have it for backup doesn't mean you want to live there all the time.


Robots makes more sense technologically and ethically. Designing humans to live on Mars sounds to me like creating a race of Martian slaves. In the old days slaves were selectively bred, in the future they'll be crispr'd.

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 Post subject: Re: SpaceX - The Quest For Mars
PostPosted: Thu Jul 19, 2018 10:42 am 
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In the long (very) run I think that we will abandon planet living altogether. Once we become a proper space faring species.

Why be constrained by a paltry narrow film of living on the surface of a rock. 2k Down you’re dead, 10k up you’re dead and all that wasted usless mass below your feet.

When spaceships are as big as contentment’s or planets, you won’t even notice the difference. They will have real, sky, mountains, lakes, geology (rather centric term I know but I don’t know what the correct term would be) etc. All the resources / raw materials we will ever need can be found in space

But we have to learn to live off earth 1st. Mars is the friendliest place close to home. It’s a stepping stone to the rest of the Galaxy.

Don’t have such a navel gazing narrow geocentric view, let’s populate the apparently sterile Galaxy with the spark of life.

Mars is the start

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 Post subject: Re: SpaceX - The Quest For Mars
PostPosted: Thu Jul 19, 2018 10:56 am 
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Terra Incognita wrote:
In the long (very) run I think that we will abandon planet living altogether. Once we become a proper space faring species.

Reminds me of a sci-fi short story that shocked me as a kid -- it was probably by Asimov -- where the space faring version of the species are returning for the first time in many generations to meet their Earth-bound cousins. There's a sickening twist at the end where the space people come down the ship's ramp and they are pink slugs, transformed by eons of zero g. :D

Terra Incognita wrote:
When spaceships are as big as contentment’s or planets, you won’t even notice the difference. They will have real, sky, mountains, lakes, geology (rather centric term I know but I don’t know what the correct term would be) etc. All the resources / raw materials we will ever need can be found in space

In order to exploit those resources we will need practically limitless energy. What that says to me is that the first nut to crack is limitless energy. Musk is wasting his time building rockets when he could be putting his efforts into nuclear fusion.

Terra Incognita wrote:
But we have to learn to live off earth 1st. Mars is the friendliest place close to home. It’s a stepping stone to the rest of the Galaxy.

I really don't think it is. When we have limitless energy we will be able to get to Mars in a matter of days on a direct route. Perhaps building Martian habitats will be a fun project once we can do that, but right now all the effort is going into dead-end development of chemical rockets.

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 Post subject: Re: SpaceX - The Quest For Mars
PostPosted: Thu Jul 19, 2018 11:16 am 
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ps200306 wrote:
Terra Incognita wrote:
When spaceships are as big as contentment’s or planets, you won’t even notice the difference. They will have real, sky, mountains, lakes, geology (rather centric term I know but I don’t know what the correct term would be) etc. All the resources / raw materials we will ever need can be found in space

In order to exploit those resources we will need practically limitless energy. What that says to me is that the first nut to crack is limitless energy. Musk is wasting his time building rockets when he could be putting his efforts into nuclear fusion.

Terra Incognita wrote:
But we have to learn to live off earth 1st. Mars is the friendliest place close to home. It’s a stepping stone to the rest of the Galaxy.

I really don't think it is. When we have limitless energy we will be able to get to Mars in a matter of days on a direct route. Perhaps building Martian habitats will be a fun project once we can do that, but right now all the effort is going into dead-end development of chemical rockets.

Musk is just sticking to known physics to get the job done and making it commercially viable at all steps is his key to success.

It's like building the sailboat to get the job done rather than waiting for the ICE powered ships to be invented.

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 Post subject: Re: SpaceX - The Quest For Mars
PostPosted: Thu Jul 19, 2018 12:01 pm 
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Terra Incognita wrote:
Musk is just sticking to known physics to get the job done and making it commercially viable at all steps is his key to success.

That's why I don't quibble too much about Mars. I don't care if he never gets there, but the commercial rocket development is pretty cool.

On the other hand, I'd love to see fusion technology get more attention as I think it's ultimately more important. It is "known physics" too but faces many engineering challenges and probably can't be done in commercially viable stages initially. A number of fusions startups have commercial funding, but they need people with deep pockets who can live with a very low chance of success for quite a number of years.

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 Post subject: Re: SpaceX - The Quest For Mars
PostPosted: Fri Aug 31, 2018 5:37 pm 
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Why going to Mars is a crap idea...

https://www.theguardian.com/science/blo ... lonisation

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 Post subject: Re: SpaceX - The Quest For Mars
PostPosted: Fri Aug 31, 2018 11:34 pm 
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ps200306 wrote:


Not a very good effort, and in any case it doesn't matter now, even if SpaceX fail, Blue Origin, Russia, China, Japan or any one in the launch business in a serious way will end up with their own version of a reusable Falcon 9, and Blue Origin are already working on two far bigger rockets, so it looks to me that its just a matter of time

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 Post subject: Re: SpaceX - The Quest For Mars
PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2018 12:43 am 
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Rocket Lab launched "It's Business Time" from its New Zealand launch site last Sunday. The company's third launch, and first commercial one, placed six cubesats in sun-synchronous orbit at 500km. Rocket Lab plans for launches to cost an incredible $5m each. Its 3D-printed Rutherford engines are similar in design to SpaceX's Merlins, running on RP-1 and LOX, but use L-ion battery-powered fuel pumps. Its Electron rocket has nine engines like the Falcon 9 and the second stage uses an identical Rutherford engine for economy of scale. For sun-synchronous orbits a third kick stage circularises the orbit at 500km.


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 Post subject: Re: SpaceX - The Quest For Mars
PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2018 5:28 pm 
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ps200306 wrote:
Rocket Lab launched "It's Business Time" from its New Zealand launch site last Sunday. The company's third launch, and first commercial one, placed six cubesats in sun-synchronous orbit at 500km. Rocket Lab plans for launches to cost an incredible $5m each. Its 3D-printed Rutherford engines are similar in design to SpaceX's Merlins, running on RP-1 and LOX, but use L-ion battery-powered fuel pumps. Its Electron rocket has nine engines like the Falcon 9 and the second stage uses an identical Rutherford engine for economy of scale


Very impressive from a small country like New Zealand, when Musk started SpaceX he had a large aerospace industry to recruit like minded people from, impossible to do that in New Zealand

Will be interesting to see what their long term plans are

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 Post subject: Re: SpaceX - The Quest For Mars
PostPosted: Sat Nov 17, 2018 2:04 am 
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the dude wrote:
Will be interesting to see what their long term plans are

As far as I know their next phase is a $140m raise to ramp up the cubesat business. It's quite plausible they could carve that out as a niche. There are huge numbers of real-world applications for cubsesats and if they can truly get launch costs down to $5m they could be onto a winner. Especially if their drag chute technology works to deorbit all the potential junk.

Speaking of which, from Wapo via universetoday.com:

Quote:
This week the FCC approved an expansion to SpaceX's plans for building a worldwide high speed internet service, adding more than 7,000 satellites to its existing plans. It was already going to loft almost 5,000 satellites, so this brings the total to 12,000. To minimize the amount of space junk, they'll orbit at a very low altitude, burning up within just a few years.

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 Post subject: Re: SpaceX - The Quest For Mars
PostPosted: Sat Nov 17, 2018 3:28 am 
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ps200306 wrote:
the dude wrote:
Will be interesting to see what their long term plans are

As far as I know their next phase is a $140m raise to ramp up the cubesat business. It's quite plausible they could carve that out as a niche. There are huge numbers of real-world applications for cubsesats and if they can truly get launch costs down to $5m they could be onto a winner. Especially if their drag chute technology works to deorbit all the potential junk]


Thats not really what I mean, for example, even before SpaceX were finished developing the Merlin engine they had started work on the Raptor engine, we will see the Raptor being flight tested next year, so I assume SpaceX are now talking about the engine after Raptor, I hope the Kiwi's are doing the same

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 Post subject: Re: SpaceX - The Quest For Mars
PostPosted: Sat Nov 17, 2018 9:32 pm 
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Explanation and interview with the CEO.



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 Post subject: Re: SpaceX - The Quest For Mars
PostPosted: Wed Nov 28, 2018 1:09 am 
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satechi wrote:

the dude wrote:
And this is for a rocket that won't be much better than the Falcon heavy or the new Blue Origin rocket, even the next ULA rocket will end up being cheaper

Right now all of the above mentioned rockets are non existent, with the SLS being the one furthest along of actually flying. 18 billion is pocket change for Uncle Sam, be happy this is money not being spent on weapons.


The Falcon Heavy beat the SLS to orbit and now it looks like the Falcon Heavy replacement will beat the SLS to the launch pad, and the way these NASA pork projects work, who knows it may beat it to orbit too

https://spacenews.com/fcc-license-application-sheds-light-on-spacex-vehicle-testing-plans/

Quote:
WASHINGTON — SpaceX has filed a license application with the Federal Communications Commission to cover testing at the company’s South Texas launch site of what may be the company’s next-generation launch vehicle.

The application, dated Nov. 19 and posted on a publicly accessible FCC database Nov. 21, seeks an experimental communications license to cover transmissions to and from an unspecified vertical takeoff, vertical landing (VTVL) vehicle that company plans to fly at its launch site under construction on the coast of the Gulf of Mexico near Brownsville, Texas.


Looks like we will see the first Dragon 2 flight in January and a Falcon Heavy too, and later in the year BSF (Starship) testing

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